Value Plan Q4 2024 - Q1 2025 Bridge Proposal and Discussion

in #valueplanlast month

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Hive Students Hub shirts at the Ghana Youth Tech Summit

We wish to open this post by asking everyone to please submit your 2025 strategy ideas here. Currently we are working on the year-end reports for Value Plan which are still being developed. Several Hive community members who are not a direct part of the project but have niche professional expertise are assisting.

We were hoping that the Q4 budget would eliminate the usual bridge, which is this proposal, but due to new opportunities that did not happen. We prefer to underestimate expenses and optimize all budgets (save and cut) rather than overestimate them and be more flexible with the budgets.

As always, your Value Plan project managers are @lordbutterfly, @guiltyparties and @crimsonclad. The key holders are @theycallmedan, @smooth, @guiltyparties, @crimsonclad and @blocktrades.

This proposal seeks 105,000 HBD for the 2024-2025 bridge.

Key Financials

Rally Car

The original rally car was sold last week. The funds from the sale are in Euro and will go primarily into Monaco in order to avoid any conversion costs.

To use a limited budget in the most economical manner we are looking at three races for the year. These races have months between them, allowing for due preparation. This discussion is best for the 2025 planning post that will come out next month, after feedback has been gathered and processed in conjunction with organizational planning already underway. The considered races are Monaco (Monte Carlo), Italy/Portugal (only one), and the CER.

Monaco - This is the flagship of all WRC rallies and the main one to attend. A Hive promotional side event is in the works. This race takes place at the end of January but is set up towards the end of November. This is the race that is covered by the sale. The costs of the side-event remain unknown at this time due to ongoing planning with a partner. Since the side-event is a pilot project, they are to be kept as low as possible.

Krolestwo

Krolestwo is the first VP-related activity that, due to its maturity and high level of professional organization, became suitable for its own proposal which included the additional cost of salaries (under VP all operations are volunteer-run). The Hive community so far has declined that level of investment. Krolestwo promotional activities will continue at the reduced costs with volunteers as usual.

Hive Legal Opinion

This is documentation that supports listings, partnerships and Hive's success in promotional events, primarily in the US market. It is four separate components which are all part of the general legal opinion package that we are presently lacking.

The cost of the documents, which are mandated to be professionally compiled, audited and notarized, is a known sum of 55,000 HBD. This bill was already expected to have come out earlier in the year but has been delayed due to the scope of work. Due to the shift in timing, the funds that were earmarked for it in prior months were repurposed for pilot events, including the Miami Art Week opportunity. Both initiatives are geared towards re-opening the US market for existing and new Hive members. This is a tremendously-challenging undertaking that will open up new opportunities that were denied to us due to our decentralized nature.

The funds for this initiative have been earmarked as part of the previous budget but repurposed for the Miami Art Week initiative (which had to be paid with urgency, see section below).

Upcoming End of Year Activities

Smaller and ongoing activities are not listed at this time due to the fact that they are subject to change, being completed or being cancelled depending on various factors beyond our immediate control. Static activities such as Vibes will continue as usual.

We are supporting the main activities below with some organizational facts. Please let us know if you find these helpful. Note that some of these costs have been filled already due to timing needs/vendors/partners.

Hive Cup

This is an annual event that is carried out in conjunction with a co-sponsor who donates the physical space and set-up costs to it, Los Aviadores in Maracay, Venezuela. This year the event will have a B2B focus, particularly when it comes to onboarding businesses in the mall, as it gives us an opportunity to directly engage with them.

Contract: Yes (non-monetary)
Audience: Local, Public, 1500
Partners: Yes
Co-sponsors: Yes

Miami Art Week VC Event

A pilot event for the end of the year, the Miami Art Week will hos a very specialized and exclusive side-event aimed at investor and partner engagement. The activity will highlight VSC and generally focus on B2B and Hive defi/investment opportunities.

Contract: Yes
Audience: Local, Private, 250
Partners: Yes
Co-sponsors: NA

Hive Community Well Project

By popular demand and request from Ghanaian communities in need following HiveFest, one new well is projected to be installed in the Ashanti Region of Ghana. The well has an expected static cost due to prices being known ahead of time and will deliver access to potable water for approximately 1000 people on a daily basis.

Contract: No
Audience: Local, Public, 4000-5000
Partners: Yes
Co-sponsors: NA

2024-2025 Mixed Activities

Mazer Gaming

Digital promotions are already taking some serious steps this year with our marketing partner Mazer Gaming working to design an engaging multi-phase Twitch streaming promotional initiative for Hive games. It is designed to show a selection of Hive games that can be picked up and played by a streamer without advanced set-up. Note: Crypto Shots and Splinterlands are already selected so far but there is opportunity for other games. A timeline can be developed based on when a game reaches maturity. Games must have a Hive account creation mechanism within them or a landing page set up for the promotion to allow for this. Please reach out to plan out for your game.

Contract: Yes
Audience: Global, 1,500,000-3,000,000+ (impressions)
Partners: No (Hive dapps only)
Co-sponsors: No

Monaco Investor Workshop

This is a side-event that is actively being planned as a pilot project and a template for future side-events. This event is to have a highly-vetted invite list. This is an activity that is in its planning phase only and its viability is still being discussed as we are working in a new geographical area. This event has ties to the Rally Car.

Contract: UK
Audience: Local, Private, 10-30
Partners: Yes
Co-sponsor: Yes

Hive Film Premiere

The Hive-made film 'Water Direct' is to be shown in a European cinema at a special event in the next few months (date TBD). This activity is projected to have a large impact by demonstrating what Hive has achieved through the unique opportunities it presents. It is directly tied with onboarding efforts, Krolestwo, and the Community Well Project.

Contract: UK
Audience: Local, Public
Partners: No
Co-sponsor: No

Administrative Discussion

waterdirect1.png
Water Direct, the film that outlines the impact of Hive in rural Ghana

Indicators

You may have noticed that we have been trying out different categorization methods and indicators for the VP proposals over time. These are all designed to help evaluate their success and support metrics. The promotional initiatives launched through VP are not stand-alone projects run by unique teams - they are all cross-functional and are by design operate as a cohesive unit to market Hive. What this means is that multiple organizers and team members will contribute to an activity. It also means that we will borrow assets from one project and bring them to another as needed. Most initiatives have 2-3 different team inputs into them.

Maturing and developing our process further supports the primary goal of Hive - decentralization. A professional process is one that can be replicated, sharded, or shared across verticals within Hive irrespective of what they are. The purpose of this process is optimization. We want to ensure all work done is value-added work as VP has a valuable donation of time that our community members dedicate to it. VP also has the input of communal funds through the DHF, which demand efficiency and effectiveness of use.

DHF Compatibility

Many have asked why Hive promotional projects are handled by the VP budget rather than being part of the standard DHF proposal voting system. The above section may have answered part of your question but if it did not, here are a few points to consider:

  • Promotional opportunities often come up fast, sometimes 48 hour notice, which does not leave enough time to write up and get sufficient visibility on a proposal.
  • The actual costs are not known at the time of engagement as we negotiate down and adjust the scope.
  • Many events are cancelled during negotiation if the organizing company refuses to respectfully cooperate or treat Hive with the same level of consideration as its centralized competitors. For example, if competitor speakers are offered complimentary speaking spots but we are not. Sometimes, exigent circumstances beyond our control prevent our participation. For example, if Hive cannot deliver a presentation on the main stage, we will not find value in paying for a sponsorship.
  • Activities drastically change mid-activity fairly often due various circumstances, such as inclement weather.
  • Fixed costs projects are ones with contracts signed; once a contract is signed we are mandated to pay. These are typically conference sponsorships or other initiatives where documents are necessary and are outside of our control. Payment is mandatory upon signing and all deliverables and responsibilities of both the organizing company and Hive are clearly listed.
  • Financial disclosure is often not publicly permitted by vendors prior to the event taking place. This is typically because Hive has negotiated a lower price than what other exhibitors are paying.

Plug-In Proposals (Update)

This being said, a template for Plug-In Proposals (that were announced earlier in the year) is in the works and will be released soon. If you missed it, Plug-In Proposals are proposals where the promotional initiative is suitable for a separate proposal but it is still meant to follow the VP method. Plug-In Proposals are still mandated to create spreadsheets with individual line items for all expenditures, keep records, and stay within the scope.
There are two types of Plug-In Proposals:

  1. A full proposal that collaborates with VP and has shared budget elements but has a project team which handles the funds.
  2. A connected proposal which has VP as the beneficiary (most will be this).

Both of these will be discussed in-depth in the upcoming strategy release. We need your input into the strategy document and if you have a stand-alone opinion on Plug-In Proposals, please add it below. Keep in mind that professionalism, optimization and efficiency are key points to consider when it comes to all proposals.

Proposal

The total of this proposal is 105,000 HBD. Out of these, 55,000 HBD is to be spent on legal documents, as describe above. The bridge amount for other promotional activities is 50,000 HBD.

Thank you for your attention,

The Value Plan Team

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$2,749,999.35 dollars wasted by Value Plan so far.

What's another $105K? Hive is thriving we got plenty to throw away.

could not agree more.
and the people controlling the account. WTF. serious.

Stop the madness

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I wonder how is this any different than Stinc programmatic sales back then (other than just different entities). I don't see any ROI for either of these.

The STINC programmatic selling was brutal but we have a lot of sell pressure with $3M+ / yr in regular scheduled proposals, and Value Plan eating almost $3M on it's own in addition, none of which was well spent. We have hundreds of thousands in proposals that rugged, if not $1M.

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Holly Shit! That's a lot of money.. 😨 In how many years?

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holy f*!

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Would be really nice to have links of receipts and evidence of performance. The text is well written but needs backing, specially for people who don't follow the project closely.

For my side of things, if theres any concern, my DMs are open (not for everyone, but for most people😅) .
Ill be happy to share what im doing, future plans are. If theres any particular payment you have a legit problem with, etc. I cant share confidential contracts or information but Im sure I can provide enough of a satisfactory response.

Will all supported projects have to come up with defined KPIs and deliverables, and then assessed based on how them reach the goals? To make it more business-like, as DHF is basically an invesrment fund?

People would feel less like throwing money away, as the most supported comment suggests.

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Yes any accountability

We tried this already and @lordbutterfly has been the only one with response to such questions with hostility and brain dead remarks.

https://ecency.com/life/@valued-customer/valueplan-strategy

Check the comments thoroughly.

Forgive me this remark, but this thing is just too silly to skip over - yes, it seems that he was like that in comments - but have you tried like he said - DMs?

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Dont think DMs will work for him. 😂
Might for someone else. Again... these are contracts that are shown to a number of trustworthy people with stake that understand legal stuff. Payments, just like the one above GP posted are generally useless. They can be edited, they show nothing.

Heres my Binance transaction for Bitbasel next month.

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Its never about receipts, invoices or anything. Its about feeling important and being able to talk shit and getting high fives for talking shit as an unproductive member of a decentralized community where anyone can contribute.
Fight the power! Its all bullshit. Some people will never be satisfied no matter what you post. No amount of proof is ever enough for a conspiracy theorist.

But if you call me a liar, claim i commit fraud, threaten me with FBI and Guantanamo bay then you get a "go fuck yourself."

Thank you for replying! I don't want to start another round of heated discussion, I just wanted to make some fun re:DMs and didn't expect you back :)

Thanks for calm(er) words and also for this image too! You totally surprised me, I got an impression you wouldn't feel like doing anything in context of that subject, especially showing anything financials.

I know, I see that, details are blacked out, I can already imagine/hear/guess/etc how someone else can point out that it's useless - but personally I take it as a good sign, instead of just slamming the door and ending the thread.

And at the same time, I don't want to ask you for showing more/etc. I agree with others that some transparency or verifiability (if that's even a word) would be great here, but someone (guiltyparties?) already said that a legal-level financial review is now being, or is soon going to be prepared, and will be made public - and that sounds fine IMHO.

To get the same answers? Receipts and invoices are not private information in this case and those things don't reveal private information.

Yes yes, I of course understand. You seem to have missed the joke part of my suggestion, I should have made it more obvious, sorry, will do better next time :)

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As others have said, I too think that we have spent more than enough money on initiatives that over the years have proved to be good for little more than nothing.
I think we should cut the race car, ~90% of the conferences (which really only serve to allow a few to maintain a lifestyle at the expense of the DHF) and from what is left demand 100% transparency.

Bills, for and for everything. No invoices? Then no HBD. And for those things that require a larger amount but require a confidential agreement, expose them beforehand (and in any case in a separate proposal).

The DHF and by extension valueplan should be treated a little more like a business (in search of monetary profit) and a little less (a LOT LESS) like an NGO.

Anyway, I feel that it doesn't matter, apparently this proposal will be funded anyway... It's really a discussion if the deal is signed beforehand?

Operating like a business is exactly the point. Even a DAO must have organisation and accountability and not cart blanche to operate without structure and with impunity.

The car only has one race which is already pre-paid. The rest are not even close to being planned or decided on yet. The entire first part of the post is about that.

I don't believe any conference will ever agree to put up their sponsorship decks publicly. I will absolutely ask them, but so far it's been a no. They will always refuse to disclose because they want to charge sponsors different amounts and hide which speaker paid what. We demand that we are treated the same as our competitors - Polkadot, Solana, and other long-term chains. Attending conferences in general isn't fun for anyone, it's very long hours of work and it's unpaid.

Supported!

However, rally car needs to be cut

Honestly if they would fully cut the rally car and stop taking the funding for it I could start to take this thing seriously again. Right now it's just mind numbing stupid. I legit don't understand the thinking of the elite few on here were you expect a constant outflow of money that brings nothing or very little back in would cause anyone to ever invest in the hive blockchain.

I'm hopeful it'll happen. They are starting the cut back a fair bit, but we need to see more going forward. I'm confident under the leadership of @lordbutterfly it'll eventually happen along with the work I've been coordinating directly with valueplan. I can't disagree though, it doesn't acquire users which I'd argue is one of the most important goals.

Valueplan is going to change a lot over the next 6 months that's all I can say for now.

Ye this makes us want to leave hive

Hi, @vaultec,

This post has been voted on by @darkcloaks because you are an active member of the Darkcloaks gaming community.


Get started with Darkcloaks today, and follow us on Inleo for the latest updates.

Simple and to the point. Duly noted.

I think we have wasted enough money on people that have nothing to show in regards to brand exposure or price. If you want to burn money just gamble the dhf money into doge or something. At least there's a chance we profit with that

Yeah it seems like insanity to continue to throw money at the rally car especially. We're just sponsoring someone else's career instead of providing something useful to the chain. Clearly it doesn't work, surely with valueplan, there should be a plan to provide value. To see if something isn't working, cut it out, and find something else to replace it.

Dogecoin, no...😂

But if you have a good idea, let me know. I mean, example, Acid set up a AMA for Hive in the biggest crypto reddit group and asked for funding for rewards to entice engagement. We talked about it. Looked at prior results. He will now get the funds for the rewards and I wrote the text for the AMA. Simple.

A good idea is easy to support. Even if people dont like the car, theres still plenty of opportunity for their good ideas to get funding from VP.

But you know what the problem is? I mean ofc you do, youre as cynical as i am😂. It actually takes time and work to get to the point of being even able to give form to an idea and then work to lead it to completion while not getting paid jack shit. 😅
Thats why the complaints and feedback is so vague 100% of the time.

A concrete idea takes work. Attacking something requires very little work.
I can write a whole blog post below about why Paella sucks and I dont even know what a Paella is.

Dogecoin, no...😂

Also dogecoin is imo a safe bet at least for the next 4 years 🙃

I actually liked the car idea at first Then I saw it did jack shit for us. Then we did it again for another year. And again jack shit. And now a third year? Why?

I don't see how saying "it doesn't work stop paying for it" is vague.

How do you know it didnt do anything? How do you know the recent pumps are or are not car related? I mean the car does precisely what its supposed to do. Raise awareness about the Hive brand. You have Hive branding on it, its seen by millions of people, lately we even changed the messaging on it to make it more crypto related. Thats what its supposed to do.
Thats the specific type of marketing. If it didnt do anything nobody would sponsor any car in WRC. Theyd all be the stock color.

Now, you could say that we could spend the money better elsewhere and that is as legit opinion as any but that doesnt mean that because they dont like the car people are forbidden or cant give us those better ideas so we give them a try.

I don't see how saying "it doesn't work stop paying for it" is vague.

I guess "lets not spend money" is not vague but its unhelpful. Its kinda: "We should have marketing but lets not spend money".
But 100% of the "we should do this or that" is completely vague and unhelpful.

MY BROTHER IN CHRIST you are asking for the money. How do we know it is doing jackshit? We don't! If you are asking for money then you should show evidence that it is doing something! We are a small community with little money. We need to know something is working. Can you please link us any kind of report showing effective results of the car stuff? Either good or bad? I am not the one who asked for the money and I am not the one who used the money to get a car and I am not the one proposing anything so I don't even know what data you can provide to back the requests, but if you want to ask for money you need to think of how you can show the value you have generated with data and something more than words.

If you manage to show the results, receipts, impact analysis and all of that then it would be HUGE for Hive because it would simply drive interest! Would you invest in a coin that buys a car? No wtf, why would I? Now would you invest in a coin that has a car and a detailed report of the impacts of having a car for its socials and financials? Heck yeah. Even if the numbers are not good it shows PLANNING and accountability!

THE DATA IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN THE ACTIVITY!

If you are asking for money then you should show evidence that it is doing something!

What exactly did I ask money for that isnt very clear what its doing? Hivefest funds were for Hivefest. The result was Hivefest and it seems a closer integration with DASH as well, as a bonus. Vibes, is pretty straight forward. Generated millions of views on social media and onboarded about a 1000 people. And the latest payment for the conference, well, thats happening in December so I dont have any results yet.

Can you please link us any kind of report showing effective results of the car stuff?

The Hive car creates brand exposure. People see it, millions in fact. You can see all the coverage numbers on the official WRC pages. TV viewership estimates, on location attendance, etc. Around 800 million TV viewers and I know Croatia WRC had around 300k people on location.

The Hive car is the type of marketing where you can never have measurable results in term of price action. Even if Hive did a 100x you would never be able to determine if the Hive car had any effect on that at all.
Now you could be opposed to this type of marketing but it doesnt mean its not doing anything. Its putting the Hive brand in front of millions of people.

Is that good enough? Depends on what you think is good enough. Maybe something else is better.

THE DATA IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN THE ACTIVITY!

The Data is not a factor of the Hive car existance its a factor of being a part of the WRC event. Now, thats not too bad of any idea, we should probably share the numbers WRC achieves from exposure even though the videos we put out do show the massive crowds of people, being interviewed by official accounts, being shown on TV.

Accountability measures should have been included for this amount of cash taken it is a joke and would only happen here lol

How do you know the recent pumps are or are not car related? I

There's no pump just a steady decline in price with the occasional Korea driven "pump". And all that in a relatively good time for crypto.

Let's not be delusional.

How do you know the decline wouldnt have been even more steep? The price continued to go up after the Korean pump and dump. How do you know the car didnt have effect on that? If Hive was worth a billion USD right now, even then you would have no way whatsoever to determine if the car had any effect at all.

Im not saying it did or did not. Im saying that its the type of marketing where you can never measurable results in term of price increase. So it can be opposed on that merit and other options presented as an alternative.

I mean, I dont personally like the boreholes, or SWC and a lot of venezuelan stuff, or the current approach to conferences which is why im trying other stuff. Vibes for example brought in around a 1000 new users, generated millions of views. Did it justify expenditure of 20ish k USD? Hard to say. Im changing the approach to conferences to assure VC and investor exposure, we will see if that works. Wer doing the reddit AMA, will see if that works.
If anything works really well the funding will shift towards that.
Its easy to complain but rarely will anyone put in work to provide a better alternative.

Its easy to complain but rarely will anyone put in work to provide a better alternative.

Here are three options that will actually yield results and are much simpler

  1. just send to null. Stops the bleeding

  2. buy doge. Medium risk high reward. Cause Elon (love him or hate him doesn't matter)

  3. exchange listings, even small ones.



Or we can get a shitty car that keeps breaking down wins no races (edit: always comes last) and nobody buys hive because of it.

The car was a fucking failure. You know it. I know it. Everyone knows it. And when fucking everyone tells you the earth is round guess what? It probably is. Stop defending it

After spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on the rally car, I don't see what benefit it has brought to Hive. Why not simply turn the 40000 Euros recouped from the previous cars' sale, back into Hive to put back in the fund and then admit it was a good try that didnt work out before moving on to something else?

A quarter of a million spent on targeting Crypto users and gamers with Google ads, advertising PeakD and Ecency rather than Hive.io might have a much better prospect of creating new users than sponsoring a car in the lowest level of WRC. Even at grassroots sports, you could sponsor literally hundreds of teams around the world who in total, would probably have created far greater eyes on brand than the rally car.

I would also ask the name of the law firm who is preparing the legal documents please and if the quote is fixed and contractual, may a redacted copy be publically posted on the blockchain for everyone to see?

As for the Water in Ghana project. Excellent. Not just because its a fine charitable cause but because one day, it may be picked up by the world's media as a sterling example of how blockchain technology and alternative funding methods can create positive impact in the world.

Do we have an official press officer at Hive who can make this happen? If not, perhaps employing one on a part-time basis and ensure members of the media are at the screening maybe money well spent.

Finally. Promotional pens cost less than a dollar each. People use pens all the time. They dont walk around wearing pink plastic bracelets.

As well as marketing the blockchain and the ecosytem exclusively, which is good to attempt to draw major investment, market the DApps themselves as individual brands, for it is they that create users. No one joins Hive. People join Ecency or Splinterlands. The DApps in turn, also need to use some of their funding to market themselves individually. Marketing and advertising is wasted if no one has a clue exactly what the product is or does thats being pushed at them.

You hit on a good point here with the fact that funneling to Peakd or Ecency would be better than hive.io, which is also the entire problem with all the advertising in general. The rally car and other similar things already pivoted to showcase the currency. Conferences and events all have dapp flags all over them. But everyone knows that the main site has to be redesigned. This main site should be managed by the Hive community, it should be redesigned professionally as a donation. So far it was built and maintained without anyone making anything off it. Someone with the design skills and the time (emphasis on time) needs to come forward and work on it. Repo is here: https://gitlab.syncad.com/hive/hive-io (MR to Develop branch)

The legal opinion is meant to be public. I don't see how it wouldn't be because this set of documents is for exchanges and is similar to the Hive Whitepaper in purpose.

Every VP activity has someone who handles journalists. Some of the larger activities have a good method of getting them to notice, usually with local press. The film screening will definitely have journalists. But in general, press is something we constantly need people with experience to volunteer for. We do have two press release writers with at least access to publishing sites. We also have publications lined up - these are paid vendors, we are starting to use them more.

Hive merch we have in all shapes and sizes: shirts, hats, mugs, pens, stickers, keychains, thermoses, markers, notebooks, bags, whatever is most economical and fits the event.

I'm going to keep posting this data because it is important ... actual data on where crypto is being adopted says the focus on Europe is not going to get Hive where it needs to go. Chainalysis has published the leaders in crypto adoption, and with the exception of Ukraine, central Europe just isn't on the list. This is the best data in the industry, and any plan asking for hundreds of thousands of dollars over and over needs to work with the data, not against it.

The 2024 Global Adoption Index: Central & Southern Asia and Oceania (CSAO) Region Leads the World in Terms of Global Cryptocurrency Adoption

The rally car may be showing to millions of people in Europe, but WE KNOW that is not the interested audience when it comes to crypto. Hive is only 24 cents in U.S. terms, and in Euro terms it is a bit lower. That's not enough to raise interest while Bitcoin is running wild.

Furthermore, I've read through the comments. There are things in here that would give any serious investor deep pause ... so, we're going to sink massive amounts of money on a car, and say, "Oh, we can't get data from the use of that money -- the pump may be because of the car, but we can't prove it." Any serious investor can go find out how that pump happened, and it's not the car. Not at all. There is not sufficient crypto interest in Europe to account for it, and besides: we can check exchange data and know better. At this point, we are running the risk of simply looking incompetent from the point of view of serious investors, because serious crypto investors compare our plans against world crypto data, and serious investors do not accept "We're spending money on things we CAN'T EVEN TRACK IN TERMS OF RESULTS, but hey: we got some attention from Europeans, although we can't track how much either, and although hard data says that's not a market we can convert users in on the very mass level we think we may be appealing to!"

Also this: this thing reeks of dumb prejudice. We already know where Hive itself has the most interest and adoption, and this data from Chainalysis has been out for a while ... but apparently, we intend to go begging to the European mass market because it is the European market instead of doubling down on what is actually working? Again: look at the data. It is clear where crypto projects should be working to get more attention.

The 2024 Global Adoption Index: Central & Southern Asia and Oceania (CSAO) Region Leads the World in Terms of Global Cryptocurrency Adoption

Every day we spend trying to impress Europe is another day other wiser projects use the real data to get ahead of Hive where people are looking for the solutions we are providing. India, Nigeria, and Indonesia, the top three countries in crypto adoption, account for markets of 2 billion people, and Latin America has a ton of representation in the top 20 as well ... so we know where A QUARTER OF ALL HUMANITY wants access to adopt crypto and is putting major action behind it. But we want to keep driving that rally car around because the European market matters so much more ... that's not just prejudice. That's dumb prejudice.

"Oh, we can't get data from the use of that money -- the pump may be because of the car, but we can't prove it."

People can pause all they want but that is the absolute truth. Its not a type of marketing that can have measurable results in terms of price action. And no, you cannot use exchange data to prove either way. Wouldnt it be wonderful if we could assign a dollar value of Hive bought based on the car existence. You can speculate though and thats fun isnt it.

But thats not even the point. The car "does what its supposed to do." It could have never done anything else. If someone thinks theres better ways to spend the money, fine, there probably is, but that doesnt take away that the car has always done what it was supposed to. Maybe people had wrong expectations, that is probably true as well.

There is not sufficient crypto interest in Europe to account for it,

I mean come on. lol. This just reeks of "dumb prejudice". What are we, market leaders, weve saturated the market? Theres no European buyers that will satisfy our glorious multi trillion chain with millions of users. 😂
If you can onboard a pub full of people on a Saturday night thats significant. Claiming theres not enough crypto interest in Europe for Hive to exploit is just silly.

Valueplan isnt even tied to any specific region and funds are spent in all parts of the world. So Europe isnt even the main focus for VP.

Latin America has a ton of representation in the top 20 as well.

How much did we spend in Latin America? I would assume nothing since all we do is try and impress Europe.

When you have that data out we're asking for, then we will know what you have spent and where, and what does have measurable results, and then we don't have to try to figure it out ourselves. As a crypto investor, I never want to read "We don't know if it's working, but let's just keep spending money on it anyway, even though good, hard data that says the 800 million we are trying to have mass market appeal with may not be the right 800 million based on regional data." I'm not even talking about Generally Agreed Accounting Principles (GAAP) type of financials yet ... I'm not even talking about up to the level of income statements, balance sheets, forms 990 ... cash method vs. accrual ... nope. I'm not even talking about what most people getting upwards of $1 million a year have to contend with. More like, "Here's how we spent the last quarter's money, here's what we learned, here's what RESULTS we're getting in terms of what events seem to be bringing in Hivers and from where, and here's where we're going to do more of what's working with the money we need next."

Now, we see what and where you prioritize just by reading your proposals and strategy post. What goes first? What's the first of the first seven bullet points in your strategy post? There's two rally cars up there. Where was the last rally car being driven, primarily, where will the next one be driven, and about the next three -- where are those activities more likely to be located? Now, Krolestwo is much lower, community wells are much lower -- so then, what are we supposed to conclude from the order of how all that is written down about VP's priorities?

Let's go back to the Sept. 22 proposal -- what's the photo showing, @lordbutterfly? You don't have to wrack your brain -- here you go.

https://peakd.com/valueplan/@valueplan/value-plan-q4-proposal-general-information

Only two regions mentioned -- what are they and where are they? Again, you don't have to wrack your brain. We can all read. Ghana, where VP has done some of its best work, gets a photo and a mention in a tiny caption, two-thirds of the way down. AGAIN, we can see with our own eyes that although Hive is doing what governments and NGOs cannot, and that is among the most powerful potential stories on the planet for crypto, that's not at all a main concern just from the layout of the proposal. So, anyone who can read and understands order of operations is going to know.

Let's go back a bit more -- since VP did not present a half year report in 2024, let's go back to Q3!

https://peakd.com/valueplan/@valueplan/value-plan-half-year-review

Go in there and add up what was spent driving that car around versus EVERYTHING ELSE ... and then come back and tell us again how VP can't show even if Hive goes to 100x how all that expenditure helped out Hive. We can, however, tell that the last pump CERTAINLY didn't come from it -- that's called checking over with our friends on Upbit and thereabouts and understanding the entire crypto cycle for altcoins to know that. REMEMBER: Valueplan wants "quality people":

What do we mean when we speak of quality of the audience? We recognize that Hive is not the right solution for everyone. It is best for individuals who are already financially stable, literate, have an interest in technology, have a business perhaps, and are able to positively contribute to the ecosystem.

I'm one of those, living in the No. 4 country in the world for crypto adoption and the No. 1 richest, and I'm telling you: there's no way, given the best crypto data in the English-speaking world about crypto adoption, that anyone like me who can read and make decisions based on hard data is going to look at VP and then look at global crypto data and say, "Wow -- they are on top of who is doing the darn thing in the crypto world -- let's put another $1M there in 2025!" See for yourself.

https://www.chainalysis.com/blog/2024-global-crypto-adoption-index/#top-countries

Now, VP can fix this. Prioritizing what we see is working can help. Prioritizing what is working in the world -- India, Nigeria (success in Ghana can be leveraged there), Indonesia, the U.S. and Vietnam are your top five countries in the world for crypto adoption, and the next 15 are in the data -- can help. Now if VP has data that says cars and conferences in countries primarily outside the top 20 are pulling people in, great -- put it out there. Chainalysis doesn't know everything -- maybe VP is beating the odds! For that matter, if VP has data about whatever is working, put it forth and be praised! Then double down on what you know is getting VP and Hive good results, and be praised and ask for even more money next time after trimming out everything you cannot show good results for. Do that and nobody has a problem, @lordbutterfly.

But you know, investors read comments as well as proposals and also look back in the VP main page. Is there a half-year report for 2024? No. Are there people asking and asking and asking for transparency all over the place? Yes. Is it forthcoming? No. Are you in comments letting everyone know that at least some things the community is paying for don't even have measurable results? Yes. Does a simple read of where the money is going and how the proposals are organized say VP is not prioritizing the right places on earth, in light of global data? Yes. This is not sour grapes -- as the type of "quality people" VP said in September that it thinks are best, I don't mind if VP gets $105K to finish this year or $1 million next as long as we can all see Hive getting good results from it and clear, accountable stewardship. That's not too much to ask for a project getting a $1M run rate a year, is it?

You dumped a lot of text, went all over the place, which pretty much obfuscated your response to the factual statement I made about certain types of marketing not being able to have measurable results in Hive price action.... here it is...

Are you in comments letting everyone know that at least some things the community is paying for don't even have measurable results?

I am in the comments letting people know that. That is something that people should have known already and those that approved the car should have been aware of it.

"Wow -- they are on top of who is doing the darn thing in the crypto world -- let's put another $1M there in 2025!"

And this is just speculation again. Again dodging the made points.

VP mostly deals with incoming requests for funding. Some of us in VP have our ideas on what should be tried but there is no overarching strategy or active effort to develop it. People are stretched as it is, nobody wants to work for free, you cant find people to even write a single post for Hive, do anything really, without pay, so its basically on a handful of people that were stupid enough to not get paid carry all of the burden.

If there is no valid funding requests from US or India, or Ukraine, whatever, then there will not be VP expenditure there.

I'll keep it short then and make it easy: do things that are measurable, leave the rest alone, and give solid accounting for what you do. Your workload would be less, and you would have fewer people asking ten thousand questions and bringing in their own data to show why what you are doing doesn't seem to be working. VP is running $1M per year on a project whose market cap is under $120 million. That needs to be justified. If I went to the store for you for $10, you are getting a receipt and change and an explanation if something is out of the expected norm. VP needs to come up to that basic standard.

do things that are measurable, leave the rest alone, and give solid accounting for what you do.

I do only do things that are measurable. Car was something that was a thing before I was added into VP and it was clear from first moment what kind of marketing that is.
Vibes is easily measurable. Conference im doing as well. Hivefest is clear as well. The social media managers are all straight forward with measurable results.

asking ten thousand questions

People have complaints which are valid and then you have attacks, trolling and threatening. Those that ask specific questions will have them answered, those that start accusing me personally of illegal activity will get a clear treatment.

If I went to the store for you for $10, you are getting a receipt and change and an explanation if something is out of the expected norm.

Ask specific explanations and ill give them. If you go broad and cover a 100 things I cannot give you those answers. VP isnt a structured system. Its simply responding to request for funding based on judgement of project managers.
I did not approve the car so you would have to ask who did and what the thought process was.

Me you can ask about Hivefest, Vibes, Social managers and the upcoming conference and how VSC is tied to it.
I did not found VP, I joined because I was asked to volunteer and help with things. I refused a few times precisely because I didnt want to deal with stuff like this here.
If you want a structured system with a somewhat corporate structure then ask for VP managers to get paid.

If you want a structured system with a somewhat corporate structure then ask for VP managers to get paid.

No, @lordbutterfly ... as someone who works in the real world with a volunteer team to manage community assets worth more than Hive's present market cap, just NO. Not being paid cannot be the reason. It is terrifying to consider it would even be offered as a justification for not having structure in place. I can understand being overworked and not paid and frustrated ... been there, done that too ... but a lack of structure is what gets us to these situations as you have to deal with now. Since you are not the founder of VP, I can accept that the lack of structure is not your doing -- but since you are a noted leader, it is your responsibility now with your colleagues. You have some of Hive's brightest minds -- @blocktrades used to run the ONLY exchange I trusted my Steem and my Hive to, and frankly, nothing has been quite as good since -- so, I know you have team members who understand what is required. Blocktrades still keeps us up on his activities regularly, and it is something that is greatly appreciated.

I personally think that Vibes and HiveFest are wonderful programs ... in the case of Vibes I can see the growth and it is fairly easy to track it. I would love to see that presented in proposals so we can all see the growth. Hivefest: same thing. Social managers I would love to know more about, and again: I would love to see those measureables. I am telling you straight up, as someone who approves a run rate bigger than VP's ask every month: when proposals begin to include the measureables and the good results up front so people can see, a lot of the stress you have will go away. I'm dropping you a big hint on better structure: put the measureables up front, and leave the rest alone for a while. Not everyone is going to like all of the measurables -- somehow, community wells seem to be highly controversial with some -- but that's something anyone can confirm is working and can be leveraged for greater exposure to Hive -- and in fact, the documentary is a form of publicity and leverage. KRK -- again, measurable, clearly getting things done.

Again, I don't have a problem with VP getting $105K more and $1M more next year, as long as we get to see the money being spent well, with good measurables. There are a lot of things VP does that are magnificent, and I would love to see them continue. A lot of us just need to see better accounting and transparency, and some sense of what VP is doing aligning with best global data on crypto adoption. I'm sure that there are "quality people" from India, Nigeria, and Indonesia who would be delighted to work with VP once the transparency issues are cleared up -- in fact I saw @sanjeevm on the VP strategy post, and @guiltyparties has already confirmed India as an area of work. I do not know as many members of the Nigerian community on Hive as I do the Ghanaian because @collinz and @mcsamm stand out, but I do know one of Indonesia's outstanding representatives: @macchiata. Believe it or not, using the data on where to promote will make your life easier -- that's two billion people to work with who want what Hive offers. I of course am from country No. 4, where there are 50M-100M crypto users out of a population of 330M, so many that they may have tipped the election toward Mr. Trump. Paying attention to those top 4 -- or, anywhere feasible in the top 20 -- will give VP success after success after success, and accounting for steady success is a lot more fun.

But, there is no way around the questions about where the funds are going and have gone until the questions are answered. Not everyone will be satisfied, but a step toward what was done in 2023 with both a half-year and closing year report would be a good start. Another good start: put out good answers for at least Q4 this year before you ask for more Q1 money. And, if there are things that have gone wrong, that transparency will give VP room to say, if necessary, "There was an irregularity here. We are putting it out with our explanation BEFORE YOU HAVE TO ASK, and here is how we are resolving it and working to avoid similar situations in future."

The car is not the central issue of this post or of 2025. Its Monaco race is already pre-paid as we had it in fiat and the others are not scheduled at all yet.

I remember your input about India before. We are pushing strong into India, there is no disagreement with you there at all. It is known that India is excellent for Hive and people are welcoming to it and to crypto in general.

I am glad to know the others are not scheduled at all ... because maybe we can stop doing what is not working to impress people who are not interested. That's the point. And, I'm not putting the data out just for you to read. I'm putting it out so EVERYBODY can read it and reflect on all the money ValuePlan has already spent versus what SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE, according to the data. You have a colleague talking about the pump may be connected to the car -- have you spoken with said colleague about that, in the face of data any investor can find and reach the conclusion that "Gee... how have they ALREADY spent millions if that is the thinking?"

The point is simple. We already know Sucre State, Venezuela, is leading the world in adopting Hive. If I'm voting for VP to get more, I want to see that prioritized and leveraged to get Hive noticed in top-20 countries in crypto adoption in Latin America. We already know Ghana and Nigeria are both in West Africa -- I want to see us leveraging the life-saving work Hive is doing to get marketing done in the No. 2 country IN THE WORLD for crypto adoption. And since we have @krolestwo, and we KNOW KRK is putting work in, let's elevate THEM and projects like THEM for Europe, and particularly Eastern Europe, which is coming on STRONG.

Despite war and regulatory questions, crypto adoption grows in Eastern Europe driven by institutions and DeFi activity

I don't even see an honorable mention of what ValuePlan is doing in India -- the No. 1 country for crypto adoption IN THE WORLD. I have the proposal open in front of me -- there's not even a mention of it.

And here is the other point: VP does not present hard data of what was spent where, and any hint to "this is where we are getting measurable results," so the only thing possible is to look at the proposals and then at global data and say: "Here is the global trend ... so unless VP has data to the contrary, there's just no way that Hive is getting the most bang for the bucks." We keep asking for that data from VP, @guiltyparties. I've read through the comments and I see there may be something on the way, but hey: I spend my off-Hive life as an investor and real-world community asset manager looking at what people tell me they are doing and comparing it to what COLD, HARD DATA says. The best crypto data available in the English-speaking world is saying CLEARLY: VP's proposals are not aligned with best practices for taking advantage of crypto adoption. VP has not presented the data on its own work to show it is exceptional and actually beating the trends, so what are we supposed to conclude here?

I don't have much of anything to really say because I mostly agree with you. The reason that India isn't mentioned in this proposal is because there's a hiveio post that's about to come out detailing its successes. It's a series of projects that don't all fall into this quarter and are ongoing beyond its range. The post is waiting on just one deliverable this week so we can really communicate the success.

Please take a look at the strategy post before this one if you haven't. Your input would help there.

LISTEN ... I don't have any piece of those millions in hand to go do work Hive has funded VP to go do. I will go look at the strategy post, but understand: VP needs to account for the fact that it has been well-funded to have a proper strategy together at this point, and should long ago have presented clear accounting for what it is doing. And, what do you expect ANYONE to do to help VP strategically when you have colleagues out here telling folks "Well, the pump might have had to do with this or that, but we can't track it and say that it's not working, so let's keep doing it?" And furthermore, @guiltyparties, you've had that Chainalysis data since the last time there was a proposal. You've acknowledged that. Do I see ANY EVIDENCE that said data was used in the preparation of THIS PROPOSAL, asking for more money? No. Now, you all choose what you want to put out to ask for votes and money -- this is where we decide whether to vote for that. How many people do you think know there is a strategy post and have time to read that and say "Well, it isn't in the proposal, but ... ?"

I will go look at that post, @guiltyparties. But you already have my input, and the best data in the world that I could find. You all at VP already can know quite a lot of what you need to do moving forward, and you have been asked again, and again, and again that if VP is beating the models and getting results, then just show that!

Further thought ... remember, @guiltyparties, you ASKED ME to go look at that post ... but before I get into those comments and tell this chain what I think, given that you have colleagues out here talking about "Even if Hive goes to 100x, we'll never be able to really say if the car did or didn't contribute," do you NOT understand that if that is true of the TOP ITEM, then everything else VP wants money for is DEEPLY SUSPECT? Do you understand that blows everything but what there are tangible real-world results on right out of the water?

If you mostly agree with me, let me give you my best suggestion: VP needs to put its real-world successes that people can see up front and double down on them, get some real accounting out here, and get on point among its members about what to record on the blockchain about whether anything it is doing is a good use of millions of dollars. On this very page, you have people running their fingers and making what would be FATAL ERRORS of public communication for a going concern without good accounting in the real world. I know the trajectory of some of the United States' most storied business collapses, and Jeff Skilling's out-of-pocket response to an analyst asking for better data is one of the best-known beginnings of the end because it destroyed any further probability of Mr. Skilling's company getting the benefit of the doubt.

The best marketing plan right now for Hive is to DEFUND THE DHF and stop all of this overspending madness.

It's unrealistic to defund all of the DHF projects but it is to optimize them. All efforts should be on optimization.

Yes, I agree but that isn't happening. Thus defunding sends a clear message. The only things the DHF should be funding are.

  1. Projects that operate hive that have expenses that need to be covered and can't generate revenue on their own. Training, back end development to help onboard more developers to make it easier, normal hive blockchain updates and so forth.

  2. A year max in which a project, developers or application are built on hive and then must show they are capable to generating revenue. Even if it's not enough revenue to be fully funded at least proof that it's working and people are using it and there's value there. Then some funding can be allocated again to offset until the application becomes self funded.

There are MAJOR expenses and inflation right now that are keeping hive prices down in general. A hyper inflation happening because of the HBD 15% Payout (Which IMO should be 5% - 7% max) a little lower than having hive and being an active participant in the ecosystem with curation. And negative pressure from an extremely over spend happy DHF that is showing little to no return what so ever.

No investor in their right mind is going to take hive seriously until these core things are fixed. That means no new developers and more importantly no new investors because as an investor you'd seriously be shooting yourself in the foot hive just doesn't make sense on the investor front.

This is beyond the scope of this post or VP but I can say that right now there is a lot of work that's going to be done in relation to building out the optimization processes and general management that dapps can then leverage on their own to improve their own performance and efficiency in relation to DHF distributions. Crypticat is helping with his expertise on getting a methodology off the ground. Can't control what other people do but can give them the tools to do it better.

I do like the sounds of that! Thank you for brining it to my attention I'll be keeping an eye out for it.

I appreciate the added information in this particular proposal but I still see NO receipts, budgets, costs or any financial backing behind the hundreds of thousands of HBD you come begging for every few months.

  • What are your operating costs?
  • What are your costs per event?
  • What are your funds left over from the last round?
  • What do you have in reserve for unexpected expenses or events?

All of this information is CRUCIAL to provide people for us to have any semblance of an idea what you are doing. There are plenty of “ideas” but very little evidence of these absolute basics.

The other thing this really speaks to the heart of - how the hell are we supposed to be taken seriously by corporations and exchanges if the people who are supposedly doing the most marketing and promotions activities can’t provide a detailed budget plan, expense report and operating costs? These are finance 101 guys. You are absolutely wasting your and our time if you can’t provide us financial information from your activities. It borders on money laundering, no joke at all. You have NO hope of doing anything in the US if you can’t provide these basics. The people in the US are extremely savvy in terms of sniffing this shit out.

I want us to succeed, but this will never succeed if you continually ignore the people who are asking you for evidence where the money is going.

You don’t have to provide names and doxx people but what the fuck is so difficult about giving us financials on hundreds of thousands of dollars every few months, coming out to several million dollars?

Putting it in “DM” is absolutely unacceptable if you are publicly asking for these obscene hands outs. If you won’t be public about it, then don’t submit a proposal. You’ve already got the backing of blocktrades (which I think is absolutely wrong given the lack of accounting) so this seems a charade.

Help us all understand what you are doing!

Good points but there is a complete set of financials coming out in a few weeks as part of the annual review. The reason they're not in this post is because we're waiting on a few refunds and some final expenses before closing off the year. The financials are going to be out very soon, with the master spreadsheet coming first because in addition to acting as a copy of the on-chain ledger, it also lets us classify these expenses.

We do not keep reserves nor ever will. We run to empty and then refill. It is like this by design because it is not the purpose of the DHF to ever contribute to any reserves, just like it shouldn't contribute to powered up funds.

One issue we know we have is the need for weekly communication. There is an earlier VP post with strategy input and a volunteer form.

Why can't we simply hire developers to create useful blockchain-based tools and then market these tools through marketing companies to encourage businesses to adopt them?

Valueplan has provided funds that eyewitnesses claim have been stolen by fraud. When @guiltyparties responded he did not offer to provide receipts to prove there had not been fraud. Instead he refused and said receipts would never be provided.

When @lordbutterfly lashed out at me for asking questions, he denied being paid anything other than for 'organizing hivefest', and when the massive payments made to him by Valueplan were pointed out his response was a stream of invective that would make a sailor blush, and ridicule for ever thinking that massive payments made to him could possibly be payments made to him.

Then he also absolutely refused to provide receipts.

I am appalled that any of you are associated with what has every appearance of being massive theft by fraud, and have put @lordbutterfly in a position of responsibility for managing significant funds without any thought to his inability to provide a professional level of representation.

I urge everyone to have a look at my post and @lordbutterfly's behaviour and responses to reasonable questions regarding expenditures. I would also remind ya'll that the DHF is partly your money. Valueplan is spending your money, and put @lordbutterfly in charge of spending lots of it, >$30k last month.

I wouldn't send him to the grocery store for a loaf of bread.

Despite Valueplan spending almost $3M dollars there are no new listings of Hive on exchanges, no big investors buying in, no influx of users excitedly blogging away, and no accounting for expenditures, nothing. What we did get are accusations of theft by fraud, refusal to provide receipts to prove there was no fraud, misleading claims about payments, intolerable insults and abuse, and the rising stench of corruption wafting across the cryptosphere.

Wipe the lipstick off this pig, because we're not dancing anymore.

Please vote the return proposal.

The only thing I was paid for was Hivefest.

Then what happened to the money?

I bought stuff with it. Not that its your concern what I do with the money I earn.

yo prick give the money back

The money you got from Valueplan that wasn't to pay you for Hivefest. What happened to that money?

It was spent on stuff as described in memo.

If it was then there are receipts that show it was. All I or anyone else wants is that you provide that proof. The memo does not provide that information, so is not any evidence of how you spent that money. If you provide that evidence it will show whether you did what was right. If you do not provide that evidence, then the automatic assumption of everyone that is observing your actions regarding this conversation will be that you did not do what was right, because you are concealing that evidence.

“If somehow you’re being prevented from knowing, then you can be absolutely certain that crimes are being committed,” Carlson concluded, “because why else would they be hiding it from you?”--Tucker Carlson

“Now listen! Today I am giving you a choice between life and death, between prosperity and disaster."--Deuteronomy 30:15

What you do will determine your fate. It is your choice to do what is right and prosper, or to not do that and suffer. I already know what you will choose, because you chose it long ago and all your actions have revealed it for everyone to see. You still will now publicly reveal which fate you have chosen.

Whatever you imagined isn't happening. LB paid a vendor last month. I have the agreement sitting in front of me right now.

Receipts have to be so heavily redacted to be posted publicly that they would be almost useless, similar to the one linked here about the car sale. This is because we've had cases of people call vendors/sponsored events and harass them. I already replied to another post committing to ask the conferences if we may publicly share their decks. I can't tell you if anyone will allow it but here's hoping.

There are new exchange listings being worked on on a regular basis, majority tied to our promotions. They do take a long time. This proposal directly funds requirements for US exchanges, which I know a lot of people are waiting on. In fact, almost the entire proposal value is for this.

The rally car needs to stop being funded. It was a nice idea at the time. The team did a good job on the design but it's too much money for where we are as an eco-system. We're bleeding funds and price right now so money needs to be carefully managed.

Conferences and events where we can attract users and devs.
Promote individual apps like splinterlands, inleo and peakd.
Cost effective ways to promote brand awareness.

This should be the focus of valueplan in terms of getting value for money by marketing efficiently to a crypto audience.

We have a hiveblocks twitter account that could be used for free, has 40k followers and little to no activity. We aren't doing the basics but we are blowing hundreds of thousands each year with no accountability and no return on investment.

Just look at hive.io and tell me that it is good enough to draw in users. We have no presence on socials like facebook, medium, reddit, instagram where we could actually convert users to our alternatives.

I think that valueplan is hurting the eco-system more than helping it and have to vote against funding it anymore as it seems to be a slush fund for a few lucky users instead of being used to bring in users and developers that we really need.

With a few exceptions like crim and mcsamm who are doing great work it's not being used effectively and with oversight.

image.png

It could be a great system to attract attention if the funds are spent wisely and everything is documented but for all the money spent i see no posts on hive or other various sites to tell people about hive or the activities. It's just not good enough for a struggling eco-system to be burning funds like this.

We have no presence on socials like facebook, medium, reddit, instagram where we could actually convert users to our alternatives.

Thats part of what Im doing right now. Ill show the results on it soon. Ive spent about 500 HBD to set up social media managers for a few dapps and projects that dont receive DHF funding that wanted them. Travelfeed, CTT podcast, Waivio and Vibes. Basically to showcase activity on Hive.

So far for Vibes its working out well, ill have some numbers for others as well. Its a very low cost but increases output significantly and some dapps perform better than others. Vibes has seen the most results so far. But its being tried.

Weve been trying to shift focus of the spending but it will take time.
What is really needed is having people willing to volunteer their time otherwise its basically 3 people having to do everything themselves for no pay.

For example: It took 2 weeks to set up a strategy and find people to work for very little money that basically spent only 500 HBD for the social media part.
It took days to deal with the AMA on Reddit wer doing. ANd that was based on which of us might have time to do parts of a basically simple online event. You have 1 person dealing with all exchange listings and another person again having to deal with accounting, collect all the invoices, deal with payments that also deals with their own projects they approved. It took a month to set up the Bitbasel conference im going to. It took 4 months to set up Hivefest with hours each day. And VIbes is also just a marketing initiative basically that also takes a lot of my time to do every week to try and develop connection, get views, get new musicians in, get people to promote it.

So wer stretched very thin. Even responding to valid comments here and those from insane people takes time out of our day.
Then you have people requesting even more work from us.
We need more people willing to contribute.

If there was any pay for all this work, or even more contributors it would be much easier to structure VP and adjust to growing demands. It simply is not. This is being pulled along by sheer determination alone.

Even responding to valid comments here and those from insane people takes time out of our day.

But us crazies love to be responded to. 😅
I'm glad to see that your working in a positive direction and we know that a lot of work goes on behind the scenes. I'm sure that you could enlist more help from the community to do the slower more basic work. I'm happy to volunteer for a couple of smaller tasks if you need.

We need more people willing to contribute.

You could manage a group of people doing the smaller tasks while you spend more time planning and coordinating. The community is full of good users who would get involved if they knew what was needed.

When the splinterlands DAO requested people to cover positions they got a huge response so if there was a list of simple but time consuming roles that could be advertised i think that users would jump in. Especially long term users who can be depended on to stay active in a role.

Personally i would much rather hire a couple of the community to work full time on these tasks ahead of certain other projects with a team of volunteers working alongside them but since it's not the case then i hope that you can find a way to spread the workload to a few more people and take the pressure off as well as see more results.

But us crazies love to be responded to. 😅

Haha. You know fair well that didnt apply to you. 😅

I'm happy to volunteer for a couple of smaller tasks if you need.

What would you be interested in doing? @guiltyparties was looking for someone to write a article about Hive. Im sure he could use help with that.

The community is full of good users who would get involved if they knew what was needed.

Even the best guys I know that do minor tasks I still end up having to pay. And they need management. I mean I could make a post asking people to do certain things which again needs quality control. lol. Might be some stuff that wont need it... Im just thinking as I write.
Maybe if we had a group on Discord someone wants to create and then kind of recruit volunteers that we could come to with some tasks to do? Maybe would work? But you see how that would also need management.

Personally i would much rather hire a couple of the community to work full time on these tasks ahead of certain other projects with a team of volunteers working alongside them

I mean Splinterlands pays Clay for this type of work. I think its like 60k a year. And Splinterlands is much smaller than Hive. If there was actual pay I could even do corporate talk with no profanity. 😂. Maybe. No promise.
But it would realistically allow us to be more structured because it would be a job. Right now its kinda, "are you grabbing this? Do you want me to grab this? Who can get on this?"
But realistically it wont happen. I can speculate on why. I have my opinions that i shared on why I think it is but it doesnt matter really. It is waht it is.

It is what it is for now but who knows what the future will hold. Until then I think that a discord is a good idea. A select group of interested users ready to help when they can.

Who knows where that might be but it could be handy when your organizing an event or activity to see how is free for 5 hours this week to jump in and help. Or if there is an article to write or graphics to draw up who can take it on.

I have only basic computer skills so can only help where it makes sense. Write articles if needed, to the best of my abilities.
I would be happy to take on the twitter account or another media account that we think could gain exposure. Push hive information to a wider audience or share interesting content to more people. Especially as peakd are now trialing ads onsite more views could have an impact on price and brand image. Nothing will bring in users faster than a big rise in price over the next year or two.

Many hands make light work so if you did have a support group of 10-20 people in a discord chat, surely it could accomplish something and lighten the load on the three for you.

I can see that a discord would need to be managed from helping with the inleo team for a while. They had a great start but unfortunately were juggling too many projects and didn't stay on top of the group that they had willing to work on their behalf. It takes a lot of time to organize initiatives of any level.

again, work on this scale really needs a full time person as organizer with volunteers to help but maybe down the line it it could be shown to be effective and how much time goes into it.

I would be happy to take on the twitter account or another media account that we think could gain exposure..

Im not sure that would be possible for the Hiveblocks account but you could DM any dapp that should be posting more and ask them to take over. For example, Ecency and Peakd dont post nearly as often but VP cant give funds towards them because they already get DHF funding. Peakd for example was interested in it. They might be someone you can ask to help out.

For the discord, I dont want to manage it. Honestly. It would be more work. But if someone else wants to do it, and it works, would be great. Im cynical as in people willing to contribute for no pay. But again, this isnt something that even needs a VP blessing. Anyone can do it themselves and run it themselves.

For graphics stuff its usually Crim that does it when she has time or I think Hive creators are paid for stuff like it. Im not entirely sure.

The Inleo thing they did was a lot of work and if you remember they did pay people in the end.

The car only has one race which is already pre-paid from the previous car's sale. We already have potential partners talking to us only on the mention of this particular race.

I agree with a lot of what you said. It's right on. Except that it goes to a few lucky users - none of the event organizers get paid. Salaries are outright banned. That's one of the reasons VP even came to be to prevent any spending on salaries.

I hope that I'm wrong and that the car can lead to something good for hive but i just don't see it at the moment. I've heard nothing that shows me otherwise.

I know that there are a lot of people here putting in a lot of work on behalf of hive so i don't want to be bashing. I want us to be successful as a community.

There are plenty more users who would help work towards this given the chance. Take the hiveblocks twitter account. Pay for the yearly premium and if you or whoever has control of the account doesn't have the time to put it to work give password access to myself, a different user or a small group to keep it active and spread awareness of Hive.

Same could go to telegram, linkdin and any other big crypto hub. Get a group of users to work on a social strategy together and make some noise.

All of these projects above getting funded should be making regular promotional posts as part of the funding that we can take and share across the board. If you were in charge of a company you would be pushing staff to get on linkdin and share every update or activity. We should be in the same mindset.

No more rally cars and definitely no private events in Monaco, who is the lucky SOB who gets to attend that on DHF money? I don't care if they are going to talk about hive and wear a hat, Stop wasting public funds!

Los Aviadores in Maracay, Venezuela.

The VP keeps wasting a disproportionate amount of money in Venezuela, by now I think you are tight with Maduro. Freeze it now, not another cent to that country.

On that note, no more wells, this isn't a charity. Give with your own money, then you can write it off. Which brings me to a point, how do we know you aren't writing it off against your private income?

Financial disclosure is often not publicly permitted by vendors prior to the event taking place. This is typically because Hive has negotiated a lower price than what other exhibitors are paying.

Convenient excuse. Disclose it after the event. With the receipts or any other excuse can be interpreted as a cover up for fraud and attempting to hide the identity of those who partake in fraud. @valued-customer had something to say about this a week ago. While I personally don't think you are engaging in fraud it's understandable that other people can come to that conclusion as you remain anonymous and refuse to provide accounting details to 'protect' people's identity. Redact their name unless they're a business, then too bad.

“If somehow you’re being prevented from knowing, then you can be absolutely certain that crimes are being committed,” Carlson concluded, “because why else would they be hiding it from you?”--Tucker Carlson

I agree with you.

Thanks!

No it doesn't work that way in terms of writing it off. That'd be the case if it was Canada or US. It is part of the checks. Normally anyone who processes funds for vendors ends up with extra taxes, which is why we're trying to get vendors to take the transactions directly and deal with the conversion themselves.

Also re: rally car, only one race is pre-paid. No other races are decided at this time.

Not a fan of the rally car stuff. I really do not see how it's still a consideration given the total lack of interest it has proven to bring. I think there should be plans to look elsewhere, that was tried and done and it clearly isn't working. Why fund it more?

I do have some concerns (think I mentioned this long time ago) but also think it is good to have a team working on marketing. My marketing approach might be different as @guiltyparties is aware of since ages - no bad feelings - we like each other. I come from marketing and do this mainly for big corporates, but also did it for known crppto companies (not commnity driven projects).

My stand here still is:

1- We need a key person to position Hive - people buy people, not tech or so - this is a fct
2 - We should maintain / develop basics of ongoing pr - not only social media
3 - Actually should be no. 1 - we need a clear plan what we wanna achive by what? Do we want to raise brand awareness (not sure that makes sense) or go there where our target group is? So next question: Waht is our target group? Do we wanna acquire users or investors? I see many events - I am biased on events - I only go to events when I know exactly that my defined target group is there and if we have exaclty the right message / solution for the needs of these attending tsrgert groups - not sure we know about the attendee structure of all these evens
4 - Film, nice one but isolated - hoipe it works
5 - Rally Car - that is always on top of all I read but really who cares?
6 - Interesting stories / topics? I see none - we had wells in Africa - that is changing the world but we could have increases this as campaign as series with interview of drivers, supporters, people benfitting from it, local politicians - not just one off stories, we need long-termed campaigns

Hpe I do not make people angry, just my view.

 last month (edited) 

I don't need to repeat that Valueplan is wasting money specifically. But I'd like to add that spending money on brand awareness is useless in general. If advertising worked, Polkadot would be in the top 10. We need to focus, and I'd like to focus on three issues:

  1. The name Hive is not distinctive enough. I made a proposal to rebrand without having to rename every piece of infrastructure.

  2. We need to give people a reason to remain active. In particular, we need to give people a reason to read Hive, not just to post. I hate Twitter, but it's where relevant discourse about politics and crypto takes place. Then I come here to read a boring fitness report from someone who barely leaves the house, with a photo of some random trash (to use myself as an example and avoid hurting anyone else's feelings). Making Hive worthwhile to read requires less focus on original content and more focus on sharing news and entertainment. I did a trial run of both with @newforyou and @memedump, but don't expect too much - I don't even manage to keep blogging regularly on my personal account. There's someone on dBuzz I don't want to single out who shares multiple YouTube videos every day about gaming and related technology, adding a short comment. That's the kind of posting I find useful, even when I rarely watch the videos. It's an example of useful curation (voting is not curation).

  3. We need to onboard organizations which have a lot of content to share from a particular point of view: charities, tourist boards, e-commerce stores, lobby and activist groups, unions, religious organizations, government agencies, sports clubs, etc. There's a beautiful synergy here: they can buy attention here in a more natural way than via ads, while we receive information about social issues which might be ignored by the mainstream media. I've said this before, and did nothing about it because it would require a lot of handholding and people skills.

Finally, there's a lot of talk about the UI as an obstacle, but people will readily use a shitty interface like Amazon.com or Microsoft Excel when it's useful to them. The two top cryptocurrencies are popular despite usability horrors like a 10-minute average blocktime or your tokens not showing up in Metamask automatically. So that's one thing we should not focus on.

Alright! the only thing I'm gonna say here is: that I read this post from beginning to end and I have read each & every single comment so far too.

And I'm still here wondering where the freaking hell I and everyone else finally is gonna be able to watch the goddamn Freechain documentary which from three years now, they sold us the idea that it would be a "piece of art" that everyone in the world would see, and after that, undoubtedly it would attract thousands of rich investors, hundreds of skilled developers and millions of new users to the Hive blockchain catapulting its token into the stratosphere and beyond all around the crypto markets.

¿When? ¿Huh?

Good evening
How do these projects actually get selected?
I'm curious as I think my @hive-woodpeckers project and my talks at a local college have on boarded more than half these projects that you fund put together.
@guiltyparties @lordbutterfly

by idiots....

That's fair enough.
Unfortunately no one else replied after I asked about it so I didn't even get to find out.
I really felt I could bring some value to the whole thing.
Ah well, on we plod!

well good luck with it! Little things like this bring so much value to hive but often get ignored

Thanks
Currently with 2 months of hive promotion I've managed to onboard 3 users.
It's not alot admittedly but with no advertising money spent, and a solid 100$+ investment total from 2 of the onboarded, it's a great start to my new onboarding efforts

That's a great project, haven't seen it before. What happens with events like that is VP covers Hive merch and logistics, where there are any.

If I was to put my project to the Value Plan in a more detailed way would they considering sponsoring it?

😊👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

lol best cash grab ever, good work!

Receipt and invoices matter to the hive public. Why is it for it being ignored? And why is questioning it being met with with DV, denial, evading the question, etc?

Why is reporting and accounting not included in the proposal

Because there is something malignant and manipulative happening here.

1ogv6r.jpg

ye I mean I just don't know about this whole system lol

There's a lot of that going on. No one knows wtf is going on and yet most pretend to, while at the same time saying nothing about themselves being robbed. Some of those want to leave, are leaving or have left or pretending to be something just to farm rewards.

By all means, if you want to set the example within the system, stake up enough to move big waves and vote accordingly to your compás and speak your mind on the issues.

Then of course theirs the more deadly penguin way. Use humor and truth mixed and point out it's flaws.

heh, nice try with AI :)

Out of curiosity, what is this 'electionwatch' account main purpose? I see some human-readable comments only from last few days, but posts seems to be going for at least several weeks, and all encoded. If cant/dontwant to explain, then maybe quicker question - Does "election" refer to the recent one in USA?

Thank you, that was an interesting read. Both about the clash with hivewatchers, and the one about election. I was few years away and I lost track of politics, views, etc, but I remember them from steem/steemcleaners, and views on what can be considered spam and what not always sparked heated discussions even at that time.. On one hand I can see how, roughly speaking, 64kb x 4 times a day can easily explode to gigabytes/year. Yes, I know, this ball-park calculation is uber-weak. USA does not vote 24/7 and whole year round. But this counter argument is just as weak, because if more states/countries jump in, volume can explode, and both sides of the fence can throw their mudballs like that forever.

On the other hand, I see your reasoning too. If you, or a group, are willing to provide necessary HP/RC for that, and even deny rewards, then wtf? It's not spam for profit. If I recall how some games or dapps dumped trash-like posts enmasse on the stream, and somehow it was OK, and profited from that, and ended up dying due to lack of ppl interest, I can't see why your was not-OK, considering that this application could actually promote Hive as a platform. And considering how "hot" is the topic, I wouldn't be surprised if, your project actually got external interest and extra funding to run. I skip over the fact that it might be hard to make this project seem "legit" and "trustworthy" for other people, but that rarely stopped an archivist, and history shows, after time passes, archives are collected, analyzed, confronted, cross-verified, and are much valued later than at time of birth.

Yet, on yet another hand, as if I had three of them, that vision of yours further down the road, where ballots are scanned and posted and so on.. To be honest, this I can't imagine done the same way. Raw image scan of every paper ballot? I might have misunderstood, but it sounds like several orders of magnitute of data volume.. Core chain itself is not a general-purpose database or a file store for media.. at least I think :P I also won't risk making idiot of myself trying to estimate the potential data size, there's too many compression formats/codecs, even color spaces, degree-of-lossiness, etc. But absolutely for sure, actual files could be stored elsewhere, and chain could be used to store hashes/fingerprints/signatures of those to provide some degree of 'authenticity' for those snapshots, apps for analyzing,supporting,maintenance,etc and organizing some general access to the data, etc..

Aaanyways.. I started flying off the matter - I just wanted to thank you for the explanation and link to the article :) Interesting read, on many levels!

This AI prompt concludes that goals, strategies, and tactics need to be outlined. This is exactly what is happening right now. My goal is to have VP processes, metrics and workflows so well documented that they no longer require any explanation to be applied by others.

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