I am quite the libertarian. That said I do think that there is value from having a society, which includes order and rules, which means restricting freedoms. One of such restrictions is to kill. The purpose of a gun is to kill. As such I think they need to be banned.
Living in the USA and coming from Germany I much prefere the security and safety of Germany over USA.
That said it's a choice. Do we want lots of killings and streets that are unsafe for the freedome to carry guns? I personally do not but I understand people who do.
However don't cry when kids get shot while you allow people to run around with guns.
Thank you for sharing your point of view. So is owning of guns completely illegal in Germany?
Yes. You can still join a gun club and have guns under very strict restrictions. I.e. I have friends who are part of a gun club, their guns are at the club but some of the members have a license to have the gun at home. Most of the people have their guns in the club.
Of course there are also police and hunters that have hunting rifles at home etc. So there are certainly exception.
However overall there are practically no guns in circulation. Of course there are exception, such as the chinese and russian mafia etc.
An example of the world of difference was a poker stars tournament that was robbed a few years ago where one of the 4 robbers had a manchete, resulting in no injuries at all and people using trash cans as weapons. Really funny actually, but the key to me is that I never have to worry about a guy in the street approaching me with a gun.
Right. Thanks for getting back to me. I see what you are saying but the problem comes when the criminal has a gun - there have been many cases here where people have been shot and been unable to defend themselves.
btw thx for your open dialog. It is always refreshing to have a dialog. Why do you think the right to bear arms is important?
I believe in freedom and having the ability to protect yourself. I don't think for a minute that it would ever become a reality here it is just too far against the culture but I think in a civilised society we should be able to discuss possibilities. Thank you for your sensible input:)
Yes I am aware of the logical argument. But it does not add up to me. If we think this out then everyone should run around with a gun and because everyone is then at risk of being shot by everyone else, everyone should just shoot each other, as to avoid being shot themselves.
Another way of looking at this is simply to compare countries that have no crime vs some that do. It's just much safer in countries without guns.
I think it is also perfectly fine to want guns. Many americans do and that is their right. It just comes with killings and crime, since that is the purpose of guns. What is illogical to me in the US is the outcry when kids get shot and the wish to have legal guns.
I'm not sure that necessarily follows though.
An antigun libertarian? I'm not making the connection. Leaps in logic a mile wide, brother.
Well I don't really care. All i can say is that my views match most with libertarians. That does not mean I agree with every libertarian and his/her views.
You are using your libertarian leaning in your argument to establish a position you are arguing from, but your argument of assumption that guns cause death, therefore ban guns flies in the face of the Libertarian self ownership principles. Mind me asking 2 or 3 of your libertarian positions?
I was a leader in the LP for years and encountered not one antigun libertarian. Just saying.
No I am not. I know that libertarians are gun lovers and I am saying that I am normally a libertarian, but in this case very much disagree with this libertarian value.
Basicallically saying I am libertarian, but in this case I am on the other side.
I do however acknowledged that this is a choice. America can choose guns or not. I for one have chosen to live here, knowing that there are guns and as such that my risk of being killed by a gun here is 10-20x as a result of my choice.
So you normally believe in personal responsibility but in this case you believe in collective blame?