Hopefully this conversation will bring some solutions. The collateral damage, not only to the authors but also to the curators of such posts (who will likely stop wasting their upvotes on posts that do not reward them), is my complaint about these wars among the whales.
Question: are these downvotes automatic? Does marky automatically downvote anything xeldal upvotes? If so, can an adjustment be made so that downvotes cannot be made automatically, but must involve a human pushing the button themselves? This way, they could better know what material they were reducing the rewards on.
I wish that the whale wars stayed among the whales -but I think that just like every war - the bigger powers have bigger guns that damage so many people unnecessarily. It's really pretty sad.
Marky has said that they aren't automatic. I clarified, and asked if he actively downvoted deraaa's post then? I didn't realize that, and I didn't really understand why
He said that he is just merely countering xeldal's votes. When I said that I understood that Acid said in the past, that xeldal used to exclusively upvote "bad content" and that Marky was just protecting community by countering - but that if it wasn't automated, isn't it possible to just NOT counter the upvote? When it's helping a Hiver who is doing the right thing?
I mean - if it's automated, I'm not sure you can selectively request to ONLY downvote posts that are spam lol. But if it's not automated and you're right there reading the post, I would think it's pretty easy to just make a judgement call right there and leave the upvote to help a fellow Hiver doing well.
I'll see if he's amenable to that - hopefully yes!! :) Let's all just keep helping the good ones, right? lol Bad can leave. but let's try to HELP the good ones stay!
I've discussed this with acid before (not as even-headedly as you) and I must point out that xeldal, at least for a while there, was one of very few curators that upvoted a certain content. It didn't matter that it wasn't spam, or plagiarized. It was content that many have been censored for on other platforms. I didn't check his activity to see what else he upvoted. Downvotes are a way of demonetizing content one doesn't agree with. Many have figured out to burn their rewards, so the posts don't get downvoted, but do get read and supported. I applaud those accounts. They are not posting for the rewards, but curators can still earn on their posts.
If marky actually is hitting his downvote on posts of value, and he knows this, then he is harming himself along with others, if only via a tiny vindictive surge.
I have tailored my content to avoid downvotes, and I know others who have as well. Downvotes may have some value against plagiarism and spam (many accounts that some call spammers are just burning rewards too), but the effect on the little people has been censorship, and behavior modification.
I have moved my posts of that certain content to a platform that will not downvote them. And I use that platform to get information and to engage in discussions that do not happen, very often, here. Unlike others on that platform, I remain mostly on Hive - don't wanna throw out the baby with the bathwater. I disagree with you the downvotes are just a given that we have to deal with. This can be modified with the next fork. There seems to be a reluctance to change them in any way though. I don't know why.
Thank you for hosting this discussion.
I have been on places where there is no downvote, and I don't really like the feel of those places. It's almost like a free-for-all for activity that hurts the whole platform, and there is no way to curtail it.
If there was a better option - I'd be all for it - and I'm totally open to brainstorming! hahaha But I just haven't found it yet. On DreemPort - we simply don't screen that material in. It's not censored, it just isn't given our promotion. The original blog is still perfectly safe wherever it came from (as we don't HOST the blogs on our site.) That's OUR way around it. Protection -without persecution. but - that's DreemPort :)
I don't agree that things are censored on Hive - because - they're not - but i ABSOLUTELY agree that there is behavior modification! and not always for the better. If there was some better way for this - I'd also be all for it. But, I'm not sure that the powers that be want it different, and since they have all the power - it will stay the way it us until enough people are affected and simply walk away
I really hope it doesn't turn to that becuase I can honestly say I've seen what's out there. Hive is the best option for so many writers. People have a chance here. But the UNTAPPED POTENTIAL of Hive will always be limited by people who are unwilling to listen and adapt.
It's just the way it is, and I sincerely hope it doesn't grow to the point where it kills us. What a terrible waste that would be.
And thank you for mentioning that the discussion was even-headed. hahaha I try VERY hard to maintain open, respectful discourse so that things can actually get DONE. And I'm really pleased to see that both publicly on this post - and privately in DMs - some amazing ideas are forming. It's exciting - and I'm really glad that I got to be a part of that. so thank YOU for being willing to be a part of that too - with respect and vision and heart. I appreciate it with my whole being @owasco!
It's mutual my dear. I hope something good comes of this, if only an even-headed discussion.
an afterthought:
I am happy to go elsewhere for the content I believe is valuable but is not present here, but I have been chastised for going there and, possibly (not sure - maybe my content just sucks) blacklisted by a certain curator. More behavior modification. Stay here, make nice here, or we will not reward you no matter how good your content is.
I don't have a problem (much) with this. I think of it all as growing pains. I believe most of us here want what is best for hive. But what some of us think is best overall, harms the smaller accounts collaterally. This is not good for onboarding. It's scary. It's hard to understand. It feels wrong.
Question - you said you just don't accept that type of content for your promotions, which is fine with me. How often do you have to overlook posts for that reason?
Hello @owasco. I've always felt this, but seeing your statement makes it all too real for my PROFILE:
Thanks for giving a voice to my suspicions, wondering, ever wondering, why? Because I know that my content is worthy.
Take care.
!ALIVE
!LADY
You have this problem too? It gives hive a bad vibe. I wish they would stop the downvotes, but they feel harming small accounts is a small price to pay for protecting the rewards pool. Of course, the rulers benefit from the rewards pool the most. I sometimes feel like they run people down in the streets with their carriages without a second thought. Nothing is different here than irl. The rich will always get richer, as long as they make the rules.
More to my point, the blacklist scenario.
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