It is ugly out there
As you all know if you follow my blogs, that I work in the oil and gas industry. For the last 9 months, which is basically all this calendar year, oil and gas industry have been going through many rounds of lay off. This is nothing new for an industry that is shrinking for at least multiple decades now, and we can only grow through acquisition. However, I am now seeing the trend spill over into many industries to the overall US job market. As per the latest jobs report, US added only 22K jobs in August. This data typically get revised downward in this cycle, so we can safely say that 22K job growth is NO GROWTH. The opposite of that data is the initial jobless or unemployment claims, which for the week of Sep 6 is 263,000, the magenta curve in the plot below, it is at 4 year high! By the way, that translates to an unemployment rate of 4.3% (typically sustained rate of >6% is considered recession)

The plot above is very simple. The blue line, the jobs created, is going down, and the magenta line is making new high. This is typically a precursor to a recession.

Trouble is recession is not an easy thing to define mathematically or by economic indicators. Definition of recession is easy, but the metric to judge it is very hard. Let me explain:
A recession is typically defined as a significant decline in economic activity that is widespread across the economy and lasts for a sustained period.
However, there are many factor or metrices to judge recession. Typically not all of them line up at the same time.
Two-Quarters Rule:
A recession is often identified when real Gross Domestic Product (GDP) declines for two consecutive quarters (six months). This is a widely used rule of thumb, though not absolute, as it may miss shorter or less severe downturns. Trouble with this is the fact that this is a lagging indicator. Meaning, you only find out after six months of negative GDP growth, so my the time you find out that you are 'officially' in recession, you are already in a recession for 6 months! You see the problem?
NBER Definition:
The National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER) in the U.S. provides a more nuanced definition, describing a recession as "a significant decline in economic activity spread across the economy, lasting more than a few months, normally visible in real GDP, real income, employment, industrial production, and wholesale-retail sales." The NBER considers the following items
- Real GDP: Declines or very low growth in inflation-adjusted GDP.
- Employment: Rising unemployment rates or significant job losses.
- Real Income: Decreases in personal income (adjusted for inflation).
- Industrial Production: Declines in manufacturing and industrial output.
- Wholesale-Retail Sales: Drops in consumer and business spending.
As you can see, there are multiple criteria, In most case you might check, 3 or 4 boxes out of five. Now it is up to you to say if you are in a recession or not! Well, depends on your life situation, you maybe in recession for many months, if not years by then!
Key Economic Indicators
These are the ones I like, because it is publicly available and you can make your own judgement call.
Unemployment Rate: A sharp increase (e.g., above 6-7%) or sustained rise can signal a recession. However, this is a lagging indicator. Just like GDP decline of 1-2% for 6 months as mentioned above, is also a lagging indicator.
Jobless Claims: A persistent rise in initial jobless claims (e.g., consistently above 300,000-400,000 weekly) indicates labor market weakness. Again, lagging indicator
Yield Curve Inversion: A sustained inversion of the yield curve (e.g., 3-month minus 10-year Treasury yields turning negative) is a leading indicator, often preceding recessions by 6-24 months. This difference between 3-mon and 10-yr (or any other number) is called a yield curve spread. This one I like it a lot, because this happens well before the onset of recession, so this is a forward looking indicator.
Consumer Confidence: Sharp declines in indices like the Consumer Confidence Index reflect reduced spending, a key recession driver. Again, slow, and lagging indicator.
Industrial Production and Retail Sales: Consistent declines in these metrics signal reduced economic activity. This is unfortunately hard to judge and difficult to interpret.
Yield Curve
Out of all these, the Yield Curve and rather the Yield curve spread is most useful to me personally. I already explained the reason, but for the uninitiated let us discuss a bit more.
A typical healthy yield curve translates to the plot above where, the longer term US treasury bond yield rate are progressively higher. This makes sense in normal cases. You are paid more to hold a coupon longer term. So in this particular case yields were:
3-month = 0.5%
10- years = 2.5%
Therefore yield spread between 3-mon and 10-yr is (2.5-0.5) = +2%. The spread is positive.
Here is the cool part. Since this is a forward looking indicator, people study this and plot this in gory details. On this plot, every time the spread goes negative, or to the top red part of the plot, a recession follows. This is NEVER wrong, so far! :)

Well, if you read this plot, we have been pushing negative yield spreads and therefore inverted yield curves for months.

Where is our recession? Incoming?
Are we in one already?
I have no prediction or advice for you, only thing I can say, if you are in a job, keep it. Do whatever you can to keep it. Take a pay cut to keep. Because, it is ugly out there.



I keep thinking that in the UK if it's not here then it's coming. The job market here is wrecked just now
You know there is a school of thought that UK never really got out of the recession of the financial crisis. The stock market did, but the economy, especially the common people economy never did.
I would agree with that school of thought. We never ever saw any boom times after that and it has been one financial thing after another whilst servicing huge levels of debt
And I would agree with you. Especially you are reporting from the ground there. I can also tell you, even here when the stock market is at all time high, with unprecedented growth from 2008, certain segments of society or say even certain sectors like retail, never really recovered. It is rather strange!
I think there really is a tipping point of wealth being sucked upward and there being far less to go around which will only increase until something breaks. Perhaps we are seeing the breaking at a societal level already!
In certain segments of the society we certainly are. When I started working, just before the financial crisis, there were popular malls that were vibrant. At least 10 of then are now closed over the years never to be opened. These are all Texas sized shopping malls mind you.
It's much the same here. Nothing really recovered after Covid. Town centres are all blighted bby closed shopfronts and only a few malls survive.
Amazon and Temu have ravaged them all!
Thanks for the information! Question, does that yield-curve-inversion indicator only work for the US, or is it the same in other nations, do you know?
Things here are starting to get ugly at the moment, the president cut the Diesel subsidies and nationwide strikes seem inbound. I'm glad I can't lose my job until the bakery is broke, but we already took quite the hit today as we couldn't send a big shipment to the coast, as the transportation company is not able to guarantee arrival.
Would be interesting to see how a recession in the US influences immigration and emigration, since we talked about something similar on your post about Japan. The current housing market in the US is affecting the housing market here I was told, as many expats can't sell there home over there, so they can't buy new ones here. But that might be just exaggeration or the blame-game coming from those who aren't able to sell :-D
It should work in any free market.
It won’t work in any market where you have price controls or subsidies! :)
You just mentioned a diesel subsidy. Free market capitalism doesn’t have them :)
Yield curve is very powerful but often hard to interpret.
Take a look at this picture above and tell me is it inverted or not :)
3 month to 10 year is slightly positive, if my eyes aren't betraying me, at least for June 2025. 10-20 are flat, only the 30 year is up again. 5 year is the lowest, so it seems like the markets are pricing in an economic downturn within the next 3 months - 3 years (expecting it to be normal around 5 years again), with the worst happening in the short term.
There are many subsidies in Ecuador that are gradually taken away, or by cold turkey just like now. The worst is going to be the LPG subsidies, we pay around $3 for a 15kg bottle. All the cooking etc. runs on gas, our ovens do, too. Electricity is cheap and subsidized, too, for the most part. It's no wonder that the country is highly indebted.
Since you have studied many an economic data - do you know if generally a cold turkey withdrawl is better, or a gradual decline of subsidies?
Yes, do in this case yield curve is inconclusive. Or we call it “flat”.
I don’t like subsidies. That does not do anyone any good. It is like a handout.
Trouble is, if you have given a handout for a while people get used to it. Then if you take that away, the government is doing tyranny!
How do you like to die? Death by a thousand cuts or a single bullet to the head? If you ask me, I prefer the bullet to the head.
As a person that plans ahead, I prefer either a sequence of planable steps or an early announced quit, so I can prepare. In that case, both works kind of fine. Not like there's much forward thinking left, but one can still dream.
My dear young friend, shall I call you grasshopper? I like you a lot, and please do to take this in any negative way!
You can't control your life or death really!
You can choose and try all you want, believe me I try too, I want to control my life and death! Oh! I so much want to!
But I can't!
I have very limited control over my life and none over my death.
Also I like to plan a lot too! But I learned from a wise man….
I prefer a paraphrased line from "Chinatown": For get it, Beel, it's Ecuador.
I think, its ugly everywhere, AI and machines will take over in few years, reducing them further and job uncertainty will increase creating more chaos. May be, that would even lead to more violence in the society.
Yes, some job lost to AI are never coming back. Entry level software coding for example. That was a massive amount of tech jobs out of India. Now I can write a decent python code with AI, which do I need a developer?
Cathy Woods, CEO of Arc Invest has been saying for a while that we are in a rolling recession.
Her prediction is that things will get better and AI like many other technologies will be a net job creator...
I don't think AI can be a net job creator. However, that said, that is the only new thing we have currently
Do you ever read Ray Dalio? Your writing style and the data plots remind me a lot of his books and blog posts.
It's weird seeing the unemployment rates and hearing about the job market being difficult. We have such a hard time finding competent people for even entry level positions.
I'm curious to see if the use of AI will create any new jobs that are being displaced by it.
Yes, the hedge fund guy. I haven’t read any of his books but I know of him. Good reminder to pick some of those books up. I love to read.
Entry level jobs: If there are lot of overqualified people out of jobs they apply for those jobs and when they get them they are typically very unhappy in those jobs. This situation doesn’t help anyone. So the moment they get something remotely better they leave and employers are back to square one.
It’s a big problem.
If you do a poll of job satisfaction and read some of the existing polls you will see what I mean.
We're even hiring people right out of college, not the overqualified ones. Recently hired someone to work on our project management team and they had no idea what an invoice was.
Dalio uses a lot of charts like you do in his books. He analyzes a lot of different data points such as education, debt, unemployment, etc. Quite a few of them you can get for free at his website if you signup for his email list. (Sorry if this is considered spam I'll delete it).
That is a different problem you are facing, competency exclusively. I wonder why that is?
Couldn't you find a better experienced individual who did understand what an invoice is?
You hired that greenhorn knowing that he/she didn't know the specifics but had other qualities you liked...
Can that individual me easily trained on the job?
In today's world what an invoice is can be learned in 30 minutes, isn't that correct?
Probably, but knowledge of invoices is a secondary skill behind reading drawings, engineering, and management (person in question has a mechatronics degree).
Well, I thought the answer was yes to both those questions. An invoice seems like a simple concept. Several times over two months I "trained" him explaining an invoice, purchase order, etc. For some reason it wasn't sticking.
His explanation was he is used to using Chat GPT for most things and sometimes has a hard time understanding new concepts. It was bizarre to work with someone so intelligent in other areas (engineering, coding, mathematics) but strugging to understand what seems like a simple concept.
I had hoped that the ChatGPT generation would still be out a few years. This has been very fast adoption and destruction on common sense. Very interesting story, as a business owner, I do have some problems with similar issues - but it hasn't been as bad, at least not yet. But we're in the process of hiring, so I'll see what comes...
Glad you found it interesting. It was certainly uncharted territory for me. I hope not all college graduates have this mentality of letting Chat GPT do all the thinking for them. I'm sure it can be a useful tool but not a good master.
This is a fascinating case! :)
Can you fire him if he doesn't get it? Because it is clearly not difficult. However, it is certainly difficult compared to copy-paste from chat gpt!
I remember I used to remember 100s of telephone numbers, now I know two exactly. I wonder is it similar case.
We were on the fence about firing him or not, he did really well in other areas so we tried to find a spot to put him where he could excel at his strengths and minimize weaknesses. He ended up resigning to go back to school and get his masters degree. His last say was two weeks ago.
It was one of the most strange cases of someone smart in certain areas yet struggling with basic concepts. He even wrote a software program to automate most steps of writing an invoice (we use excel, nothing fancy).
It must be something like this. It's the same for me, I can remember many phone numbers from childhood but so few now.
Also with driving. Certain places I have been dozens of times but I'm not sure I could get there without GPS. Sad to admit it.
I feel like consumer confidence isn't as accurate of an indicator as it used to be. These days people continue to consume even when they can't afford it, so I'm not really sure how much that would change. I can see how it might be helpful along with the other factors you mentioned.
I agree, it is not. I don’t trust neither the consumer nor their thinking ability! :)
It’s scary how fast things can change in the job market. The numbers are worrying, but the real impact is on people just trying to get by.
I think the recession will disappear after the interest rate cuts. It won't happen quickly, but I predict it will end before 2026.
In theory, in the US, based on the economic indicators, we are not in a recession.
On a separate note; your KE ratio is 22. With that kind of high ratio, you shouldn't get any upvotes.
Fix it please.
I'll try to fix it. By the way, the KE ratio calculation is unfair.
For example, why aren't witness earnings included in the calculation?
It is fair. Most witnesses do not post.
I wish they would share. The quality would improve even more this way.
What should the maximum K.E ratio be? I just lowered it to 21.84.
Edit: Let me read it right away.
https://hive.blog/hive-180505/@azircon/ke-ratio-a-personal-perspective
Below 3.0. You have a long way to go.