Upbit in Trouble?

in LeoFinance5 days ago (edited)

We got used to having good news coming our way from the South Korean exchange Upbit, even though P&D are only good news if you profit from them, otherwise, not really.

Follow Friday, and later dug into it on my own, Upbit may be facing some hard times ahead.As I learned from @steevc's

They have been in a process of renewing their license in South Korea, and the South Korean regulators apparently found many issues, primarily with how they handled KYC. More than half a million cases "with problems", news outlets say.

As someone who hates KYC, I feel sorry for Upbit, but I have my doubts their regulators will.

Now they received a notice to suspend business operations for any new users for 6 months, to which they have a deadline to respond until Monday, and the restrictions (or not, but unlikely), will be imposed from the next day.

Not the kind a notice a business high-ranked official wants to read. The AI helped me imagining the scene.

Note that it doesn't include existing users. For them, it's business as usual.

The problems arise from the other side of the penalties - the fines. According to Korean law, Upbit faces 100m Korean won in fine per case (user that was found with issues regarding KYC). That's above 68k USD per user times half a million (minimum). That's over 34bn dollars.

Obviously, that's a huge amount to pay as a fine for any company. Now, it matters if they get a reduction or what's the payment schedule for this fine. Because I assume they would fight to pay it over time instead of at once, if the law permits it.

In any case, Upbit may be on a shaking ground as a business because of the enormous fine. But we will see more in time. Next week the final decision will be made and restrictions applied (I'm not sure if fines will be set then).

What we are mostly interested in is HIVE, obviously. If I remember well, there were at one time around 120m liquid HIVE on Upbit (out of 464m, including staked HIVE). Not sure how things stand now, but it's by far the biggest amount of liquidity for HIVE in one place. Binance is second, but at a distance.

The good thing is existing users on Upbit are unaffected. The bad thing is the potential uncertainty of the Upbit business if they get slapped with such an enourmous fine, and the impossibility to attract new users for 6 months, if the restriction gets imposed.

The question is what will HIVE holders on Upbit do? Especially the whales, since it is to be expected to have at least a few whales there in HIVE, given the amount of liquidity.

I tend to believe whales will continue to hold. They either know they'll be safe on Upbit or they'll move on to a new home, but they'll hold HIVE. Once getting used to seriously influence the price of a coin, you don't want to give up that power easily.

Smaller players on Upbit for HIVE... I don't know what they will do. They may follow in the footsteps of the whales, being used to the probable profits, or some may get scared and try to get out from a potentially sinking ship, in various ways (by withdrawing to the chain, by moving HIVE to a Binance wallet or another Korean exchange, let's say, or by selling to KRW and withdrawing?). We will see...

This is a big opportunity for other exchanges to list HIVE (particularly from South Korea, which have KRW too), in case there will be an exodus away from Upbit. Otherwise, Binance has the products, the volume, and the desire for more liquid HIVE, judging by the APR offered on Binance Earn for HIVE (now lower, since the volume - and therefore demand - dropped since the pump days).

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I assume most countries have strict regulations for exchanges and it seems they got caught out. They have been influential on $HIVE and maybe that will change. We used to have a lot of Koreans before the fork, but I'm not sure many moved over to Hive. They could create accounts and power up, but maybe they expect bigger gains than what they can make here. I'm not a trader, so I have a different perspective.

Thanks for the insight.

!BEER

but I'm not sure many moved over to Hive

Yes, I think so too. Many preferred to stick to Hive on Upbit, rather than on-chain, post-split.

maybe they expect bigger gains than what they can make here. I'm not a trader, so I have a different perspective.

At higher risks, yeah, I suppose exchanges have ways to make it more profitable for traders than for regular users of HIVE. But, as I said, at higher risks... The same risk they face on Upbit wouldn't be on Hive, or would be much, much, lower.

It would be good to see more crypto communities move to Hive as is happening with Dash. They tend to end up using centralised platforms instead. I think this was meant as an alternative to reddit originally.

Absolutely! I remember the Korean community was ok. The bad blood happened because their most influential community/project (the one that held the proxy votes for them and maybe many other Asian users), sided with JS in the conflict on st**m, after a while during which they took no side (publicly or by voting), and during which they were courted by both sides.

It sucks to hear that they are running into trouble. KYC is always a pain and I honestly don't like it that much in crypto, but that is the only way for them to do legal business.

Yeah, I agree, that is the case in probably most jurisdictions. Maybe they are showed some indulgence, but I don't think so, given the high number of issues with KYC.

I wonder which CEX will benefit in case of Upbit's closure. How about the pump and dump of HIVE coming from Upbit? Will it stop? If HIVE is no longer accessible for South Koreans, what will be its impact on HIVE's price?

I wonder which CEX will benefit in case of Upbit's closure.

I don't know what will Koreans prefer. Binance is a top player, but maybe they will prefer a local player.

How about the pump and dump of HIVE coming from Upbit? Will it stop?

Not sure. Maybe. Or maybe they'll find another place from where to do it. The liquidity will still be there to be used... somewhere.

If HIVE is no longer accessible for South Koreans, what will be its impact on HIVE's price?

HIVE continues to be accessible to South Koreans. For Upbit, unless they go bankrupt, existing users are unaffected. As for new users within 6 months when Upbit may be under restrictions to have new users, there are other exchanges with Hive listings available in SK (Binance, for example).

Thanks for the reply.

This is crazy
Hive may likely get affected. Don’t you think so?

We'll see. Not unless Upbit itself holds big stashes of HIVE. Otherwise, if things get messy, existing users can go elsewhere. It's Upbit which may be in serious trouble. And we will lose their listings, if it goes bankrupt. The scenario where I would worry would be if Upbit itself holds a big part of those HIVE, because they would likely need to sell assets to pay the fine.

Interesting share! I didn't know about this. Maybe that's why there's no weekend pump this week.. LOL!

So far I think the price of Hive is moving along quite fine, although there's always room for improvement, hehe!

I have a feeling there are some deep pockets on Binance accumulating Hive, particularly now since they have futures there too.

That's good to know, hehe! Let's wait and see.

Upbit exchange is where Hive price is determined. Even the smallest problem can affect Hive price a little. Hive whales can move their assets to Binance. As far as I know, Binance accepts South Korean users.

As far as I know, Binance accepts South Korean users.

Most likely. They even seem to have KRW, which I'm sure many Korean users want to have.

that is worrying a bit - have to read what our local media says. Thanks for the invite - i am sitting on some cash and wanna buy back Hive - maybe this is te good outcome, given we got some traction also by other listings I think we ware more stabler as in the past.

Well... this is probably not good news for Upbit, but they probably knew the risks of their actions. For Hive... that volume (as much as it is real, although the liquidity is definitely real), will find another place, if it comes to that, because other exchanges would want those fees.

true - i hope at least - not a trader but Hive does not act like i want it to act - please udner 40 sents today and jump to 70 tomorrow - need to buy back Hive :-)

I wouldn't want the price to go below 48. It would take a LOONG time to recover if it breaks down through the 45 support. Right now the price formed a nice support at 48 and a good potential up from here, if nothing bad happens for us.

Understand but my plan was bying back at 40 :-)

So do you think other exchanges in Korea would be like "you know what, we want some of those whales on our exchange too"?

I think the idea of being slapped with a fine creates uncertainty, let's see how it pans out, because news like this creates jitters

@tipu curate

I do think other exchanges will want those transaction fees, absolutely, and will start to court users of Upbit who may want to jump ship.

The situation with Upbit is known for a bit, at least by insiders (the notice was received on January 9th), and nothing drastic happened. I don't believe whales are in the business of crashing the price of their holdings, particularly when it's nothing wrong with them, only potentially with the exchange. They find smarter ways.

This is worrying. It might affect the price of Hive. Maybe the whales should move their assets to other exchange

They know better than us what to do with their assets... I wouldn't worry about them as much. I would worry if Upbit itself held a significant amount of HIVE in their wallets. And I don't think we could know anything about that, yet.

This might affect the price of HIVE in the next couple of days

I don't think so. Insiders knew since January 9th.

It is a big news as I was waiting for Hive to continue to rise up

It might still do. It's one thing Upbit, another Upbit users' coins. At least we hope so.

I am hoping that it does not effect too much the value of hive

So far so good...


BEERHey @gadrian, here is a little bit of from @steevc for you. Enjoy it!

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