how we might go about constructing a world that is more representative of reality and the needs of the present moment. This part of the discussion continues into the overtime, where Benjamin and I explore what a post-pandemic world might look like and what this means for our conceptions of governance and the individual. So without any further ado, I bring you my conversation with philosopher and author Benjamin Bratton. Benjamin Bratton, welcome to Hidden Forces. Thanks for having me. It's great having you on. So you and I have spoken briefly by phone and just now I've read your book this weekend. I think the entire framing of the book is fascinating and it touches on a lot of the topics that I've raised on prior episodes of Hidden Forces. Before we get into the book, I'd love for you to describe yourself because you're a rather eclectic guy. You seem to have, you don't fit into a box, not even close. So I'm curious how you describe yourself and what are your interests? What drives (2/42)