Attorney Seibert claims Ethereum token pre-sale is an obvious sale of an unlicensed unregistered security
My opinion on this topic
I don't actually agree with the interpretation of Ethereum as being a company or business, or believe that Ethers are securities. At the same time I'm not a lawyer. I present this legal perspective because many others have posted in favor of the ICO model and claimed that there are little to no risks involved. The fact is that this is not very clear as to what the legal status of is or how regulators will treat it. In fact, if we assume regulators will treat it as securities then perhaps we can take a more active approach toward resolving these issues by either pushing to exempt ICOs from this regulation or by self regulating it using technical means and norms.
If we find regulators are likely to bring additional risks then it becomes possible to push to relax regulation in this space. Now I do agree with Jason's point that some of the marketing of Ethereum probably was not honest. Unstoppable contracts? Code is law? The DAO showed otherwise and that promise was really stupid in my opinion to put as official marketing. Calling it an investment also isn't very wise in my opinion.
A long time ago we realized that your project can be thought of many ways.
What you think you are doing
What a government thinks you are doing.
It doesn't matter what you think you are doing.
It's whether a government can convince a judge that what they think you are doing matches the same facts.
Isn't there a way we can just keep the regulators out of cryptocurrency? I mean, c'mon. Everybody knows they're dirty. Why are we inviting government mobsters into the house? There's no way that will end well for anyone other than the mobsters.
This is why most Crypto Companies are basing themselves where the law is holding their hand in places like Zug and Singapore. The US is mostly likely one of the worst. Recently we have seen more and more ICOs excluding US IP addresses. Of course that is very easy work around with VPN. Most regulation only helps the rich get richer. Excludes the little man. They scream protection but the facts are clear. Most extreme regulation just kills jobs and wealth.
I post my opinions here: https://steemit.com/ethereum/@dana-edwards/every-crypto-project-must-have-a-risk-mitigation-plan-prior-to-launch
Regulators have the agenda of reducing certain risks. The risks they are focused on might not be the same risks you're focused on as a developer and or user of the platform. In areas where interests align then platforms need to do a better job self regulating and controlling risks, such as dealing with actual scams, theft (like TheDAO), etc. But then in areas where no one is being protected by the regulatory action (victimless crimes) then there is no responsibility of developers to make regulatory persecution easier. Developers in fact in my opinion should make that more difficult.
So the point is, platforms need to deal with risks and self regulate. Platforms need to do this more effectively than external regulation mechanisms. We have to recognition what the reasons are for these regulatory agencies to exist in the first place and when it's a valid and justified reason then we can simply take on the same responsibilities through technical measures. We can reverse a theft with a hard fork, we can detect scams, we can use our own means of arbitrating disputes using smart contracts and blockchains, but what we cannot and should not do is ignore security and the risks.
The summary of my opinion is that as a community the developers and users need to develop their own regulatory equivalent of a crypto-based SEC to manage it's own risks which the SEC is set up to manage. It is not necessary for the SEC to intrude on blockchains and technical means of risk reduction unless the technical means fail and there is no other solution left. So my stance is I'm in favor of self regulation over external regulation with external regulation being truly the last resort if it is revealed that with the technology the community cannot self regulate. All centralized institutions are vulnerable to regulatory capture and regulatory failure, while decentralized institutions are untested and it is not known if they'll work for self regulation.
jdc, we invited the mobsters into the house in 1913, and the BIS would like to take down the cryptos which is why they must survive if mankind is to have any chance at all
State overreach.
This is similar to how the world resists the world of classical business. Crypto currency is breaking the existing system. But you can not ignore them. Naturally, now they are poorly regulated by law. But you can look at it from the other side. If the world financial system and laws corresponded to people's interests, then crypto-currencies, smart contracts and other similar technologies would never appear. Perhaps the developers are not entirely honest. This can be seen as a manifestation of corruption. But this exists in the ordinary business, despite all the laws and regulations.
laws and regulations used to serve their intended purposes, now used mainly to employ bureaucrats, and to repress the ill-informed
Ethereum is a scam. Yes. Definitely. Yes. Scam. All the way. Don't buy any. If you do, i'll take the scam coin off your hands. Thanks.
LOL
What is the consequences if etherium is truly not registered and unlicensed?
Well, if you're a multi-millionaire from launching Ethereum then I guess being rich is the consequence. Beyond that, I don't see any other obvious consequences to the founders.
I thought holdings will be forfeited
I am not sure what you mean.
I thought the etherium that are own by people will be forfeited in case... will be out of value.
Thank You for the Heads-Up !! I just joined Steemit 3 days ago.
I just followed You, please consider following me... Cheers !!
Jason's show is great.
I don't care if something is "unlicensed" or not. All licensing is a scam imposed by the government on society.
What I care about is if they are being honest. A license neither insures honesty, integrity nor safety.
If your an American and don't claim your profits from it you will be charged with tax evasion.
Are you referring to income taxes? Capital gains taxes? This is known and these can be reported. The IRS audit and charges are another example of regulatory risk and it's a risk each of us faces with very little information on how best to avoid it. Perhaps better information and guidance should be released by the IRS so that it can help law abiding or people who intend to be law abiding to reduce their level of risk through compliance. If people don't know how to comply or if there is no practical means of complying then it's unlikely there will be a lot of compliance.
The fact is, the IRS as an agency seems to despise cryptocurrency or completely ignore it until it's ready to do a John Doe summons? As a result congress is now demanding the IRS give some answers and honestly I'd like to know for myself what their intentions and plans are so I can reduce my risks.
References
Both income taxes and Capital gains taxes.
If it's called an investment you must pay taxes on it if your a Citizen.
Me, I gave up my citizenship and do not pay taxes any longer.
When you give up citizenship you have to pay taxes to a certain point if you owe any. Also you don't gain anything by renouncing citizenship, you just lose whatever rights you had. So now the US government can legally spy on you am I right?
It all comes down to what is US citizenship worth to the individual? For some people, citizenship isn't worth as much as they can gain from cryptocurrency. That being said, just because you renounce in one place, doesn't mean you'll be more attractive as a stateless person.
My stance is, if I choose to remain a US citizen then it's in my best interest to be a good citizen. That means I have to comply with the law, pay the taxes I owe, adhere to the customs as best I understand them. I currently see nothing that can be gained by being a bad citizen in terms of freedom.
For US Citizens:
http://www.coindesk.com/us-congressional-group-calls-on-irs-to-clarify-bitcoin-tax-guidance/
saw that earlier today.
Citizen is not defined as a human being.
Citizen only has limited rights and privelages.
Human being is entitled to human rights
When you consent to be a citizen you forfeit your human rights.
I have a post on your human rights that will explain what you are entitled to.
https://steemit.com/law/@healthiswealth/do-you-know-your-human-rights
There is no military or law enforcement agency which can enforce "human rights". Show me the people with guns willing to use them to secure my human rights? At least as a citizen I have legal rights which is better than nothing at all.
It's called the Supreme Court that can enforce your human rights.
🍁 I just did a new post 🍁
Add a new entry daily to the draw 😜
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