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RE: Hey christians! You may give me all your money

in #christianity • 9 years ago

Nice piece of research. This is the single most use useful and theologically correct post you have ever made - a very valuable compilation of relevant Scripture.

Thanks!

The only error is your belief that your access to Heaven is permanently denied. It's never too late to turn around as long as you have one conscious thought left.

Sorry but you are wrong on this. There is actually one occasion when an individual loses the chance for getting into Heaven.

So I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the one to come. (Matt 12:31-32)

I have spoken against the Holy Spirit several times and because it can't be forgiven, I'm banned from Heaven forever. Mark 3:29 and Luke 12:10 make the same point.

As to sending you money, you have already achieved a commendable freedom from it. It just wouldn't be right to cause your addiction to something from which the rest of us are still struggling to escape.

Of course there are a lot of people in the world who are poorer than me. But because I live in a welfare state, everything is very expensive, forbidden and/or heavily regulated. My purchasing power is not really that great.

9 years ago in #christianity by
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     9 years ago  

    Given your willingness to discuss this subject and your familiarity with Scripture, I seriously doubt that you have committed the unforgivable sin. After all:

    1 Timothy 1:13-15 = “Although I [Paul] was formerly a blasphemer, a persecutor, and an insolent man; but I obtained mercy because I did it ignorantly in unbelief. And the grace of our Lord was exceedingly abundant, with faith and love which are in Christ Jesus. This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief."

    The penalty of eternal separation from God with no hope of return applies in scripture only in two cases—either, as in Hebrews 6 and 10, to persons who willfully, publicly and explicitly reject Jesus as Savior after having confessed him, or, as in the gospels, to those who blaspheme against the Holy Spirit by declaring that the works of Jesus were the works of the Evil one.

    I found this explanation somewhat helpful: The Unpardonable Sin

    When Jesus spoke to the Pharisees, He told them that all sin and blasphemy (defined by the scribes as a direct and explicit abuse of the name of God) is forgivable. He then added an exception for a very specific type of blasphemy, that which is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. In context, the Pharisees had just said that Jesus’ power to cast out devils was by Beelzebub (Matthew 12:24). Beelzebub means “lord of flies,” and was the name of a guardian deity of the Ekronites (2 Kings 1:2). The Jews used this name as an epithet for Satan. In this context, the Pharisees were saying that Jesus was of Satan. The scribes also attributed Jesus’ power as given by Satan (Mark 3:22). The words of the Pharisees and scribes were blasphemy of Jesus. Their words were a direct and explicit abuse of His name and a rejection of who Jesus is.
    This blasphemy by the Pharisees and scribes led Jesus to expound more clearly on a sin that was, and always will be, unpardonable—the blaspheming of the Holy Spirit. Since the work of the Holy Spirit is to testify of Jesus, when someone blasphemes the Holy Spirit they are rejecting the testimony of the Lord Jesus Christ.

    While someone is doing that, there is, by definition, no way for help to reach them.

    So just quit doing that!

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     9 years ago  

    Well, I don't know... That interpretation seems to be kind of far fetched. I think Jesus is quite clear on this case. If somebody speaks against Holy Spirit, it won't be ever forgiven.

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     9 years ago  

    Only when that rejection becomes settled and firm is there is no hope for forgiveness.

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     9 years ago  

    Google "unpardonable sin". There's tons of commentary to that effect.

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       9 years ago  

      If somebody takes Bible seriously and literally, there shouldn't be any need for interpretation. Jesus means exactly what he says. Why else he would have said that?

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       8 years ago  

      This is by far the best chat dialogue I have ever seen, so much collaboration . Jesus4Life!

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       9 years ago  

      That's why I said you should read the large body of commentary (of which I provided a sample above). You can take the Bible seriously and literally and still spend a lifetime understanding the deep implications of everything that Jesus said. Jesus spoke in parables so that only those with the right attitude would understand him. There are many audiences for his words across all time and one should not assume the simplest surface meaning is all there is.

      Besides, its not in your best interest to assume the worst case. That way leads to the dark side. While there is life there is hope.

      “A certain man had two sons. And the younger of them said to his father, ‘Father, give me the portion of goods that falls to me.’ So he divided to them his livelihood. And not many days after, the younger son gathered all together, journeyed to a far country, and there wasted his possessions with prodigal living. But when he had spent all, there arose a severe famine in that land, and he began to be in want. Then he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country, and he sent him into his fields to feed swine. And he would gladly have filled his stomach with the pods that the swine ate, and no one gave him anything.

      “But when he came to himself, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired servants have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger! I will arise and go to my father, and will say to him, “Father, I have sinned against heaven and before you, and I am no longer worthy to be called your son. Make me like one of your hired servants.”’

      “And he arose and came to his father. But when he was still a great way off, his father saw him and had compassion, and ran and fell on his neck and kissed him. And the son said to him, ‘Father, I have sinned against heaven and in your sight, and am no longer worthy to be called your son.’

      “But the father said to his servants, ‘Bring[a] out the best robe and put it on him, and put a ring on his hand and sandals on his feet. And bring the fatted calf here and kill it, and let us eat and be merry; for this my son was dead and is alive again; he was lost and is found.’ And they began to be merry.

      “Now his older son was in the field. And as he came and drew near to the house, he heard music and dancing. So he called one of the servants and asked what these things meant. And he said to him, ‘Your brother has come, and because he has received him safe and sound, your father has killed the fatted calf.’

      “But he was angry and would not go in. Therefore his father came out and pleaded with him. So he answered and said to his father, ‘Lo, these many years I have been serving you; I never transgressed your commandment at any time; and yet you never gave me a young goat, that I might make merry with my friends. But as soon as this son of yours came, who has devoured your livelihood with harlots, you killed the fatted calf for him.’

      “And he said to him, ‘Son, you are always with me, and all that I have is yours. It was right that we should make merry and be glad, for your brother was dead and is alive again, and was lost and is found.’” -- A parable of Jesus from Luke 15:11-31

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       9 years ago  

      Yeah, Jesus spoke in parables, but I don't think that is case in this situation. He is not telling a story, he is stating facts.

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       9 years ago (edited) 

      I have spoken against the Holy Spirit several times and because it can't be forgiven, I'm banned from Heaven forever.

      The ministry of the Holy Spirit is to testify of Jesus, to point us to Jesus. When that testimony of the Holy Spirit about who Jesus is and what he came to do is fully rejected then one has truly blasphemed the Holy Spirit. Only when that rejection becomes settled and firm is there no hope for forgiveness.

      How can someone know if they have blasphemed the Holy Spirit?

      The fact that someone desires Jesus at all shows that they are not guilty of this sin.

      Do you want Jesus? Do you want to put your faith in him? Do you seek after him at all? Then this is evidence that you have not finally and completely rejected the testimony of the Holy Spirit. The continued rejection of Jesus makes us more and more hardened against him and puts us on the path for a full and final rejection.

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       9 years ago  

      I have rejected Jesus pretty much all of my life, so I don't think that even this interpretation will save me.

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       9 years ago  

      So just quit doing that!

      Then Stan has the best answer above. :)

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       8 years ago  

      1 Samuel 16:7
      But the LORD said to Samuel, "Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The LORD does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart."

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       8 years ago  

      God judges the heart.